voices to make a nation cry

[azaghal1981]

Not exactly.
 Hillary tried this during her campaign's last breaths and it failed miserably then. This is undoubtedly a desperation move that will either backfire, plunging McCain's numbers even lower or leave things as they are. Yes, at this point, I think it's fair to say that the election is Obama's to lose. If he doesn't commit any grave political errors in the next month, he's home free.
 
 
   

Originally posted by manimtired:
  here we go...obamas past coming back to haunt him in the last month...rut row.

[godsshoeshine]

i dont know that its obama's election to lose, but i think voters want to hear more about the tanking market rather than crimes from 40-20 years ago

[kosmo vinyl]

i'm just glad that the Obama camp is finally bring up McCain's connection with Keating... i certainly hope more is said about his ties with lobbiests

[Venerable Bede]

Originally posted by god's shoeshine:
  wait, when has liddy EVER repented for plotting to kill john anderson, plotting to firebomb the brookings institute or plotting kidnap protesters. he even wrote about it in a book which he profitted from. mccain appeared on the man's radio show just 5 months ago, which to me points to a stronger relationship than obama to ayers. liddy didnt just plot to kill people, he tried to kill democracy, and mccain took money from him and helped liddy make money this year. i dont see how we're supposed to care about ayers and not liddy

really?  really?  how on earth can you even compare the two?  
 
 i'm reminded of the scene from "12 angry men" where, to use the jack lemmon/george c. scott version, they are arguing over the words "i want to kill you" and george c. scott clings to those words as proof that the son committed the murder. . .jack lemmon carefully refutes his points, whereupon george c. scott lunges across the table says "i want to kill you". . .jack lemmon causually says, "surely you don't really mean that."
 
 that's what we have here. . .plotting vs. throwing firebombs to kill, maim and injure. . .
 
 now, i have no doubt that obama (i can't necessarily say the same about his more fervent supporters) does not support the violent overthrow of the u.s. and the capitalistic system (unlike ayers and his wife). . .but i am concerned that obama is trying with all his might to hide this relationship.  why?  it's almost a known fact that he knew ayers several years before he claims to have met him; it's a fact that ayers helped get obama on his education program; it's a fact that obama helped channel funds to ayers and his education program (nevermind that that project was an abject failure and a waste of millions of dollars, nor their work together on the woods foundation); yet, at each turn, obama says it's no big deal, he's just some guy from the neighborhood.  while they do live in the same neighborhood, ayers is not simply some guy in the neighborhood.  
 
 even cnn weighs in on this. . .and does a much better job than the ny times, not surprisingly.

[Venerable Bede]

Originally posted by kosmo:
  i'm just glad that the Obama camp is finally bring up McCain's connection with Keating... i certainly hope more is said about his ties with lobbiests

In a confidential report submitted to the committee on Sept. 10, the special counsel, Robert S. Bennett, concluded that there was not adequate evidence to merit a full-scale investigation of John Glenn, an Ohio Democrat, and John McCain, an Arizona Republican, several officials said. . . .
 
 I'd also recommend reading  this.

[Sage 703]

Just...wow:
 
 http://washingtonindependent.com/10456/hate-mail-in-communist-county

[manimtired]

i wouldnt get too comfy just yet...polls are getting tighter.
 
 http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE4961BK20081007?sp=true

[hutch]

Originally posted by manimtired:
  i wouldnt get too comfy just yet...polls are getting tighter.
 
  http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE4961BK20081007?sp=true

not according to gallup which has the biggest sample..
 
 51-42...

[manimtired]

zogby was the closest in calling the 2004 election.

[Sage 703]

Originally posted by manimtired:
  i wouldnt get too comfy just yet...polls are getting tighter.
 
  http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE4961BK20081007?sp=true

Actually, they're not, as your statement ignores the fact that this is the largest lead that Obama has had in the Zogby poll since July 9 - July 13.  Try using facts next time.
 
 http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html#polls

[manimtired]

ok..there is a poll that has the race at 2 points too...is that also a big lie im trying to push on this here message board.  
 
 try not boring people with your band as openers next time. LOL.

[Venerable Bede]

Originally posted by callat703:
  Just...wow:
 
  http://washingtonindependent.com/10456/hate-mail-in-communist-county

i think we can all agree that this type of stuff is terrible. . .i have a friend here at work that wears her mccain/palin button on her coat and won't walk into the local coffee shop anymore with it on for fear of what extras will go into her order; she gets looks and glares from people on the street all the time.  
 
 on the other hand, she relays to me a story from the other day. . she was walking to lunch and came across a table full of cindy sheehan supporters, drumming up support for her race against nancy pelosi. one of sheehan's supporters runs up to her, sees her mccain/palin button and stops, unsure of what to do. . .the supporter than walks up and says, "she [sheehan] can't be any worse than nancy pelosi, can she?"

[godsshoeshine]

Originally posted by Venerable Bede:
  really?  really?  how on earth can you even compare the two?  
 
 i'm reminded of the scene from "12 angry men" where, to use the jack lemmon/george c. scott version, they are arguing over the words "i want to kill you" and george c. scott clings to those words as proof that the son committed the murder. . .jack lemmon carefully refutes his points, whereupon george c. scott lunges across the table says "i want to kill you". . .jack lemmon causually says, "surely you don't really mean that."
 
 that's what we have here. . .plotting vs. throwing firebombs to kill, maim and injure. . .
 
 now, i have no doubt that obama (i can't necessarily say the same about his more fervent supporters) does not support the violent overthrow of the u.s. and the capitalistic system (unlike ayers and his wife). . .but i am concerned that obama is trying with all his might to hide this relationship.  why?  it's almost a known fact that he knew ayers several years before he claims to have met him; it's a fact that ayers helped get obama on his education program; it's a fact that obama helped channel funds to ayers and his education program (nevermind that that project was an abject failure and a waste of millions of dollars, nor their work together on the woods foundation); yet, at each turn, obama says it's no big deal, he's just some guy from the neighborhood.  while they do live in the same neighborhood, ayers is not simply some guy in the neighborhood.  
 
 even cnn weighs in on this. . .and does a much better job than the ny times, not surprisingly.

i dont have cnn at work, but the comparison is apt. both candidates associate with folks that did terrible, antiamerican things in the past that the candidate had nothing to do with (or with keating little). i dont see how you can completely dismiss one and not the other. i know that the gop doesnt want to talk about issues, but theyre going to have to go a heck of a long way to make this the election

[kosmo vinyl]

it would appear that as usual Republicans are teflon coated and Democrats are covered in fly paper    :roll:

[Venerable Bede]

Originally posted by god's shoeshine:
  i dont have cnn at work, but the comparison is apt. both candidates associate with folks that did terrible, antiamerican things in the past that the candidate had nothing to do with (or with keating little). i dont see how you can completely dismiss one and not the other. i know that the gop doesnt want to talk about issues, but theyre going to have to go a heck of a long way to make this the election

i can compare it because where along the road to john mccain's path to congress and the senate did g. gordon liddy factor in?  did g. gordon liddy smooth mccain's entrance into the naval academy?  did g. gordon liddy hire mccain as naval congressional affairs rep after vietnam?  did john mccain announce his run for congress from the home of g. gordon liddy?  was g. gordon liddy a long-time benefactor of john mccain?  in all those instances, the answer is no...but in the role bill ayers played in the construction of barack obama, ayers most definately played a major role, both in obama becoming a politician and in obamas own personal values and beliefs about this country (but not the terrorism parts).  
 
 as for keating, mccain most definately learned something from that. . after all, it's called "mccain-feingold" and not just "feingold"