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=> GENERAL DISCUSSION => Topic started by: HoyaSaxa03 on February 07, 2006, 05:06:00 pm
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i finally got around to renting and watching scorcese's dylan documentary, and it is FANTASTIC ... i think the best thing it did was take a sprawling look at his tectonic shift from folk to rock, and it was really hard for me not to draw parallels to current events
watching the folkies (especially pete seeger and baez) self-righteously talk about bob's "betrayal of the cause" reminded me so much of today's anti-globalization/capitalism crowd ... it was really fascinating to actually see dylan's independent spirit fly in the face of not only the "square" establishment, but also the holier-than-thou activist folkies, who wanted to paint him into a corner and cage him up like their personal canary (not to mix metaphors) ... i could think of a number of bands in recent years to have similar experiences and come out much richer (sleater-kinney is the first that springs to mind), but i had the same visceral reaction to watching seeger and baez go off on dylan for not writing "topical songs" as i do towards the naive anti-IMF crowd
the press conferences really had some of my favorite parts, with over-zealous insane-sincere fans asking questions about the meaning of the motorcycle on his shirt on the cover of "highway 61 revisited" and square reporters asking stupid questions about labels and song meanings ... the banality of some of these moments really gave you a sense of why he rejected the "voice of a generation" tag and was fiercly musically independent ... i guess some could say that his "independence" was really just him selling out to the rock world, but i really didn't see it that way
if i had to choose between this and "don't look back", i'd definitely take "don't look back", just because it withstands repeated viewings and you can always find new nuggets and ways to look at the scenes, but scorcese really outdid himself with "no direction home" .... the story has obviously been told in books and articles and whatnot, but to see the actual interviews and footage from the 65 newport folk fest and press conferences from the era is just fantastic ... any more thoughts on it?
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The interviews were nuts. I thought they treated him like E.T. :p I agree definitely way too much pressure on him.
My favorite is when Dylan randomly spewed words from the signs outside the mom-n-pop grocery store.
I thought the first part was very similar to events and the timeline in his book (Chronicles). My cousin (a producer on the long video) said that was interesting b/c Scorcese didn't read the book...
It's up for a Grammy...vs. The Ramones (another good long video).
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Originally posted by El Sugartastic:
My favorite is when Dylan randomly spewed words from the signs outside the mom-n-pop grocery store.
that was fun, it seemed like he was as high as a kite ... i also really liked the interviews with ginsburg, he had some thoughtful things to say (especially about the whole "passing the torch" thing)
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I watched this a couple of weeks ago and fell in love with Bob Dylan. It was a surreal experience. I never "got" him. A crazy admission, I know, from someone who thinks of herself as a music fan. I just never loved loved loved his music.
When the DVD was over, I sat for a few minutes with my mouth open.....Wow. When my friends asked the normal, casual question the next day, "What'd you do last night?", my response was, "Fell in love with Bob Dylan."
Some of them laughed, like "oh, okay, welcome to the world of music." Good point.
I read Chronicles last year and loved it. Read it again a few months ago.
Now, 25 years after first being exposed to his music, I am a Dylan fan. Way to be ahead of the curve there, Arlette. ;)
Needless to say, I thought it was amazing.
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Originally posted by Arlette:
I watched this a couple of weeks ago and fell in love with Bob Dylan.
if you haven't seen "Don't Look Back" by D.A. Pennebaker, you should rent it ASAP ... it's kind of a different look at this era, casts dylan in a different light (he's kind of a dick) ... but the movie itself is groundbreaking, we actually watched it in film class as an example of cinema verite and documentary film-making ... i think it's considered one of the first rock concert films, although there's much more back-stage stuff than performances
speaking of film geekery, i just saw broken flowers and i was really struck by the way jarmusch used diegetic sound throughout almost the whole movie ... there was rarely a soundtrack or any music playing that didn't have a specific role in the plot ... like the only time you would hear any music is when bill murray would put a CD into his stereo or hear it from some other within-the-plot source ... it added such a cool dimension to the movie, you almost never see it in a "normal" film like that
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Originally posted by Arlette:
I never "got" him. A crazy admission, I know, from someone who thinks of herself as a music fan. I just never loved loved loved his music.
Hmmm, that's my situation. Seems like I should see this film.
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Originally posted by HoyaParanoia:
speaking of film geekery, i just saw broken flowers and i was really struck by the way jarmusch used diegetic sound throughout almost the whole movie ... there was rarely a soundtrack or any music playing that didn't have a specific role in the plot ... like the only time you would hear any music is when bill murray would put a CD into his stereo or hear it from some other within-the-plot source ... it added such a cool dimension to the movie, you almost never see it in a "normal" film like that
Are you familiar with films that follow the guidelines of Dogme 95?
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I really began to like Dylan a year or two ago when he harshed on hippies in one of his interviews, and said that his biggest aspiration was to have a middle class suburban life.
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I hate Dylan. He dangles money in front of Donnie's face, and Donnie comes running, right in the middle of the BR549 tour. What is Chuck going to do without Donnie?
Plus, I think he's done some creepy things when it comes to women.
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Not everyone can be a morally superior male supermodel like you, Rhett.
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What has he done to women? I mean, besides writing the lyrics, "lay lady, lay, lay across my big brass bed."
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Originally posted by HERR PROFESSOR DOKTOR DOOM:
What has he done to women? I mean, besides writing the lyrics, "lay lady, lay, lay across my big brass bed."
Ministry does it better ;)
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Originally posted by econo:
Are you familiar with films that follow the guidelines of Dogme 95?
i am now (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95) ! interesting stuff, but i'm really not that much of an artsy film consumer, broken flowers is towards the outer edge of what i can take in terms of minimalism
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Check out Italian for Beginners with your girlfriend. Good start, although borderline romantic.
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Originally posted by HoyaParanoia:
Originally posted by econo:
Are you familiar with films that follow the guidelines of Dogme 95?
i am now (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95) ! interesting stuff, but i'm really not that much of an artsy film consumer, broken flowers is towards the outer edge of what i can take in terms of minimalism [/b]
'Celebration' was great.
'Mifune' was OK.
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horrible, horrible movie
i just saw broken flowers
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if i'm not mistaken, orson welles's "touch of evil" was one of the first films to make full use of source music/sounds. one of the reasons he completely disowned the original theatrical release is that the studio put some really bad mancini music in where it shouldn't have been.
Plus, I think he's done some creepy things when it comes to women.
well, that's all the evidence i need right there. no more dylan for me!
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Originally posted by Bags:
Originally posted by Arlette:
I never "got" him. A crazy admission, I know, from someone who thinks of herself as a music fan. I just never loved loved loved his music.
Hmmm, that's my situation. Seems like I should see this film. [/b]
When I was a kid, some of his songs grated on me (think Kermit on hormones.) Different songs, tones and changes he took, I could take him or leave him.
The book - eh, okay. It's the editing (Dylan's writing) I can't get through. I definitely like the "inside look" to his life back then.
Maybe I need to watch this other video and see "No Direction Home" again. As much as I like some of the footage, etc. I didn't fall in love w/ Dylan by watching.
Couple years ago, a friend told me to get "Blonde On Blonde". Another musician friend has some amazing Dylan covers, so I learned to appreciate the songs/lyrics more.
When I really "got" Dylan was when I saw him live.
So, yeah, he had me at 9:30. ;)
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Originally posted by HoyaParanoia:
it seemed like he was as high as a kite ...
Skinny as one too!
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i listened to "it's all over now, baby blue" 7 straight times in the car last nite. and that probably doesn't even crack my top 10 dylan songs. that scene in the hotel room with donovan in "don't look back" where he sings that is truly a Great Moment In Cinema. the 13th floor elevators cover is one of the better dylan covers i've heard.
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Originally posted by econo:
Check out Italian for Beginners with your girlfriend. Good start, although borderline romantic.
added to my blockbuster queue, thanks for the tip
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Originally posted by Rob_Gee:
Originally posted by HERR PROFESSOR DOKTOR DOOM:
What has he done to women? I mean, besides writing the lyrics, "lay lady, lay, lay across my big brass bed."
Ministry does it better :)
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Originally posted by HERR PROFESSOR DOKTOR DOOM:
Heh... it's times like this that this board pays off... I wasn't aware that Ministry had done that... thanks. :) [/QB]
It's off the "Filth Pig" cd. :cool: