930 Forums
=> GENERAL DISCUSSION => Topic started by: markie on September 23, 2003, 12:13:00 pm
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Tour Vote......
you can request bands that you would like to see live and then they email if they play in the area......
Typical for the blackcat to be ahead of the 930 club.
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Originally posted by Bubba:
Typical for the blackcat to be ahead of the 930 club.
Yeah, their forum is great. Why do you do us all a favor and spend more time over there?
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Why Dont I?
sar·casm   ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (särkzm)
n.
A cutting, often ironic remark intended to wound.
A form of wit that is marked by the use of sarcastic language and is intended to make its victim the butt of contempt or ridicule.
The use of sarcasm. See Synonyms at wit1.
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Originally posted by vansmack:
Originally posted by Bubba:
Typical for the blackcat to be ahead of the 930 club.
Yeah, their forum is great. Why don't you do us all a favor and spend more time over there? [/b]
How's that?
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take a look at tourvote.com... it's pretty lame and why the hell would the 9:30 club even care what bands people want to see anyways. i'm mean unregulated voting for the likes of icp and michelle branch? the data would be useless to the 9:30 club anyways.
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Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
it's pretty lame
I thought it was quite a reasonable idea. Plus it is somewhat empowering.
Oh and Vansmack, very good. Now you need to work on (pr) sark.zm.
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Originally posted by Bubba:
Oh and Vansmack, very good. Now you need to work on (pr) sark.zm.
I'm not sure if I'm the one that didn't get the sarcasm in this post.
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Originally posted by vansmack:
I'm not sure if I'm the one that didn't get the sarcasm in this post.
I guess that is the beauty of the beast. You can say something daft and then resort to a sak.zm defence.
When is/was stereophonics? Have you listened to their new album?
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Originally posted by Bubba:
When is/was stereophonics? Have you listened to their new album?
They were last week. They were good, but I enjoyed their acoustic show at the 9:30 a couple years back much more. There new stuff seems a bit heavier than their old stuff, but since I had only seen them acousticly it was diffeent experience for me. Smackette loved them, so it was probably a great show (she had never seen them before and didn't have the Acoustic show bias that I had).
I only own "Just Enough Education to Perform" so the new stuff (which I don't own, but listened to on their web site) was much more drawn out Brit rock and less Brit pop. This isn't a knock on the show, because it was good, and they're really talented (their Beatles cover was amazing) I just was so impressed by thier acoustic show that it would be tough for them to come close to that in my eyes. I would defineitely see them again.
I also saw Social D the night before and Ness came out and did an acoustic trubute to Johnny Cash doing his Cowboy punk thing. It was great. And yes Rhett, he did Ring of Fire and got the first verse wrong. Again.
We have Supergrass/Radiohead tonight. I'm looking forward to Supergrass. I saw them a couple of months ago in Anaheim at a warm up show for this tour and thought they were unbelieveable. Hopefully Smackette will wake me up when Radiohead is over. I watched their $2 Bill show over the weekend to see if maybe I was missing something in not being excited about the show. Nope, it's not me. It's their melodies that are missing as you have so eloquently pointed out over the years.
And Jag, I'm sorry to let you down (frankly, I let myself down) but we missed the Grandaaddy/Super Furry Animals/Elbow show last week do to another engagement that was horribly boring and Smackette has not heard the end of it yet. Women. Kill em all. That's what I say.
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Thanks Vansmack,
I dont really think that much of the stereophonics new album. It is american rock by numbers some by Welsh guys. Not a great idea, if you ask me.
I still am fond of J.E.E.P. and performance and cocktails though. I would like to see some of those songs live somemore. But if they are pissing around doing Virgin megastore shows, I guess I am going to be out of luck.
I bet if you keep your expectations low, you will really enjoy radiohead. Especially when they play Ok computer and before, songs.
I think I would rather hear life on other planets though.
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Youre right. They would just book Michelle Branch regardless. And Michael Buble.
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
take a look at tourvote.com... it's pretty lame and why the hell would the 9:30 club even care what bands people want to see anyways. i'm mean unregulated voting for the likes of icp and michelle branch? the data would be useless to the 9:30 club anyways.
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Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Youre right. They would just book Michelle Branch regardless. And Michael Buble.
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
take a look at tourvote.com... it's pretty lame and why the hell would the 9:30 club even care what bands people want to see anyways. i'm mean unregulated voting for the likes of icp and michelle branch? the data would be useless to the 9:30 club anyways.
[/b]
or Wilco
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Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Youre right. They would just book Michelle Branch regardless. And Michael Buble.
[/QB][/QUOTE]
How very defeatist of the two of you. I suppose neither of you vote in elections either?
Some black shows only have 50 or so people at them, I am sure it wouldnt be too hard to get that many votes from the area for some interesting bands.
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The funny part is, the shows that sell out at 930 (Jewel, Manson, Timberlake) are generally the ones, we on the board here, chastize the club for booking anyway. So maybe 930 club would like to think they are a little more in touch with the concert going crowd then that.
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It's true, SPIN, we make up a pretty small group of concertgoers (though I'll bet boardies go to more concerts than most people, by far). Hell, before I started keeping up with this board, I knew *way* more about new music and upcoming bands than almost any of my friends, save for a couple. And here on the board, I'm like Miss DC101, in comparison (no, I don't listen to DC101, but what I know about and listen too seems to be in the more mainstream 'indie' vein).
Don't know that we'd have much sway on tourvote, unless you can vote again and again!
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9:30 Club is a large venue in a medium size city that has to rely on SOMETIMES booking overly commercial acts to turn a profit. Simple matter of economics.
TRhe 9:30 Club lost its "hip" factor the day it moved to V Street. The biggest criteria in bokking a show at the 9:30 Club is turning a profit. Hasn't Seth said that any number of times?
Originally posted by Bubba:
Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Youre right. They would just book Michelle Branch regardless. And Michael Buble.
[/b]
How very defeatist of the two of you. I suppose neither of you vote in elections either?
Some black shows only have 50 or so people at them, I am sure it wouldnt be too hard to get that many votes from the area for some interesting bands. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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So I just went to tourvote. It's not a Black Cat feature, they just put a link on their webpage. It's run by someone else who will notify artists, venues and promoters about the votes and the interest in a region for seeing a particular band. Then tourvote emails you when one of your requested artists comes to your zip code. So, votes ostensibly should be passed on to Black Cat *and* 9:30 Club, though it's not clear if venues have to be 'members' or some such thing of tourvote.com. - Bags
From the WEBSITE:
"YOU buy concert tickets and pay cover charges. So you should be able to tell the industry which acts YOU truly want to see -- LIVE, on stage. TourVote gives local fans the power to influence which musical artists perform in your metro area! All TourVotes are made available to the artists, promoters and entertainment venues who make live shows happen -- so they'll know where shows should be scheduled.
You may vote for a particular artist only once but you can vote for as many different artists as you like - anyone you really want to see on stage. Be sure to provide a valid email address -- because when the show gets scheduled in your metro area, we'll send you a TourAlert message. You'll be among the first to know the details, buy tickets and more. TourAlerts will be available in Baltimore and DC by early Fall and will be available in other areas nationwide soon thereafter.
No matter where you live, it's not too early to cast your votes NOW for any act you want to see. And let your friends know about the revolution in live entertainment. You can leave it up to other local TourVoters or you can let your voice be heard."
TourVote is a way for you to take an active role in determining what live entertainment is available to you, near where you live. Here's how it works:
You place a vote (a request) to see ANY live show by ANY artist or group
We let the artists know how many people want to see them locally. Also local entertainment venues, concert promoters and the like.
With a good understanding of the local demand for a show, they schedule it in an appropriate club or concert venue.
We let you know, via TourAlert, when the show will be, the show time, the cost, how to get tickets and more.
IMPORTANT: We must have your valid email address so that we can alert you on the shows you voted for. Have no fear of providing your email address (link to our Privacy Policy below).
TourVote uses a patent-pending process to collect from consumers, through multiple web sites, their expressions of desire to see specific live performances by any entertainer or entertainment company. We call it demand identification or Demand ID.
The demand information is then made available to the persons and companies involved in producing and hosting live shows and concert tours. TourVote data is used to make decisions where entertainers will tour regionally, nationally and internationally. Once those decisions are made, TourVoters who live in or near the scheduled tour cities are alerted and provided special offers of the artists' music and, in the future, advance ticket purchase privileges.
You'll receive one of our email TourAlerts when a show for which YOU specifically voted has been scheduled in your vicinity. So you don't have to worry about an inbox flooded with miscellaneous entertainment information. TourVote is about what YOU want - from a little-known coffee shop folksinger to the latest Backstreet Britney megastar.
TourVote serves another important purpose - by helping musical artists to perform in profitable live shows, we are helping more of them to "quit their day jobs" and focus on their first love (and yours) - music.
What we're NOT
TourVote is not a music site. But we help music sites to deliver live music to their site visitors - not just recorded music. And, if you're like most people, you like to have the latest CD in anticipation of the show. So we help our partners to reach you at that moment.
TourVote is not a concert promoter. But we help concert promoters to deliver the shows ticket buyers really want.
TourVote is not a record company nor a talent agency. But we help those companies to discover rising, new talent at the earliest stages of their popularity.
TourVote is not a vote-for-your-favorite-song-or-artist-or-CD thang. It's not a popularity contest. It's a tool to help communities of people get what they want in live entertainment - rather than being spoon fed what someone else guesses that you might want.
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Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Hasn't Seth said that any number of times?
not in as many words, "give the people what they want would be equally appropriate".
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Originally posted by bags:
And here on the board, I'm like Miss DC101, in comparison
yes bags....my friends think i am a music encyclopedia and here...i have been relegated to "SPIN" magazine. its fun talking to people SO smart everyday isnt it?
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Originally posted by vansmack:
And Jag, I'm sorry to let you down (frankly, I let myself down) but we missed the Grandaaddy/Super Furry Animals/Elbow show last week do to another engagement that was horribly boring and Smackette has not heard the end of it yet. Women. Kill em all. That's what I say.
Oh, that's too bad. I am dying to see Elbow again and soon!
And don't forget, it was a woman who told you about Elbow being at the show. ;)
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Originally posted by bags:
So I just went to tourvote.
thanks Baggy,
so I still think its a good idea.
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Seems the people want Jewel and the Mighy Wind.
I'll bet the 9:30 Club raked in a fortune the past two days, what with the three $40 Mighty Wind shows (two sold out) and a sold out $40 Jewel show...four $40 shows in two nights.
Look at the Billboard charts...that's what the people want.
Originally posted by Bubba:
Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Hasn't Seth said that any number of times?
not in as many words, "give the people what they want would be equally appropriate". [/b]
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tourvote is "good" idea for the blackcat or the velvet lounge especially for regional acts trying to playing at those venues. it's still up for street teamer abuse. the data collect for the 9:30 site would be less useful i.e. 10 votes for The High Strung verses 5,000 votes for Good Charlotte. Most booking agents go direct to the club anyways already knowing their acts are going to succeed there.
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Interestingly, I could not sell even one out of four extra tickets to the Sunday night 'late' show of A Mighty Wind. It was really weird. Once that insanely long line, which went on forever, was in the club, there was not a soul on the street or in front of the club. I wasn't the only one who didn't get rid of extra tickets.
Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Seems the people want Jewel and the Mighy Wind.
I'll bet the 9:30 Club raked in a fortune the past two days, what with the three $40 Mighty Wind shows (two sold out) and a sold out $40 Jewel show...four $40 shows in two nights.
Look at the Billboard charts...that's what the people want.
Originally posted by Bubba:
Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Hasn't Seth said that any number of times?
not in as many words, "give the people what they want would be equally appropriate". [/b]
[/b]
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And I'm all for it!! It's how the Club can sustain itself and still be able to book bands with loyal but small followings, like Idlewild or The Juliana Theory recently.
Originally posted by Rhett Miller:
Seems the people want Jewel and the Mighy Wind.
I'll bet the 9:30 Club raked in a fortune the past two days, what with the three $40 Mighty Wind shows (two sold out) and a sold out $40 Jewel show...four $40 shows in two nights.
[/QB][/QUOTE]
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But that's my question, Kosmo. Do the votes from the Black Cat site go only to the Black Cat management, as kind of "black cat votes"? I didn't think so on my first (but pretty thorough) read of the website. It sounds like the votes go to various venues in that area around your zip code, which is how you vote (though it is noticed that you've voted through the B.C. website).
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
tourvote is "good" idea for the blackcat or the velvet lounge especially for regional acts trying to playing at those venues. it's still up for street teamer abuse. the data collect for the 9:30 site would be less useful i.e. 10 votes for The High Strung verses 5,000 votes for Good Charlotte. Most booking agents go direct to the club anyways already knowing their acts are going to succeed there.
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Originally posted by bags:
But that's my question, Kosmo. Do the votes from the Black Cat site go only to the Black Cat management, as kind of "black cat votes"? I didn't think
nor do I, the votes must get sorted by Zip code......
I wonder who pays for the service? Clubs, or the record industry?
Just because an act is popular in the billboard chart does not mean a lot of people will want to see it live and vice-versa.
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Voting for bands you want to see strikes me as not unlike radio "request" shows... you know, the type of show where callers usually request something in heavy rotation anyway, so by providing the "request" line it makes these people think they actually had a say in getting that song played. It's not empowerment, it's illusory empowerment.
looking for internet porn? (http://www.alex.to/lavalampcity)
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Originally posted by bags:
Interestingly, I could not sell even one out of four extra tickets to the Sunday night 'late' show of A Mighty Wind.
how did you wind up with 4 extra tickets?
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First, as a matter of full disclosure, I'm one of the principals in the company that runs TourVote. I don't want to abuse the hospitality of the 9:30 by plugging what we do, but I would like to respond to a couple of issues raised in this thread. (Moderator, please let me know if this is a problem for you.)
Bags asks, "But that's my question, Kosmo. Do the votes from the Black Cat site go only to the Black Cat management, as kind of "black cat votes"?"
Answer: Only the BC (or any other partner) gets to see which votes came through their own site. Other venue partners get to see how many potential customers (if any) in nearby zip codes say they want to see a given band play live, but not where those people cast their votes. Artists, music publications, etc., see other appropriate slices of aggregated, anonymized data. NOBODY except us EVER gets to see the e-mail addresses we require for vote validation.
Dr. Doom wonders whether the "empowerment" is illusory.
Answer: We certainly hope not. The idea is not after-the-fact endorsement of what the music business already does. It really is for the fans to to tell the business what they want. If enough fans do that, we believe that the business will listen and begin to act accordingly. Out of self interest and because, all cynicism aside, most of the people in it really do care about delivering shows that get fans excited.
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I literally had three friends cancel on Sunday; two were hungover, one is an attorney and got called in to work. I wouldn't have gone alone, but since I couldn't sell the ticket.....
FYI, I have *no* problem going to shows alone, but it was sold out. I did go, though; it was great.
Originally posted by Seth Hurwitz:
Originally posted by bags:
Interestingly, I could not sell even one out of four extra tickets to the Sunday night 'late' show of A Mighty Wind.
how did you wind up with 4 extra tickets? [/b]
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Liberte, your answers were really helpful. So who is involved? (You may not be able to say, but that is the lingering question).
And has it been useful? -- I see that it's been around for a while.
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Liberte, thanks for taking the time to come on here and address these questions. That's unusual and refreshing.
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Thank you kind sir (http://www.badmovies.org/movies/billyjack/billyjack3.wav) Yadda Yadda Yadda Yadda
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I think it's great as well, we had a Tickets.com rep hanging around these parts at one point. The more music industry insider adding input to the board is a good thing imho.
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Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
I think it's great as well, we had a Tickets.com rep hanging around these parts at one point.
Really, those fuckers have balls showing their faces in public!
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Thanks all for your indulgence and encouragement. Glad you found it useful.
Bags, I'll try to get back tonight or over the weekend to answer your question and any others that come up. Way too much to do right this minute for a small group of people taking on a big challenge (which may be a partial answer right there).
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Originally posted by Liberte:
answer your question and any others that come up
I have a question? How did you find out about us talking about you? Was it via some sort of internet search, or what?
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Spy!
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Originally posted by Edsall Park:
Spy!
Yes, that is exactly what I had thought all along.
Great minds think alike. :D
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did no one else think it odd that the topic was only half a day old and the name of the company was not in the topic title, yet they found it so quickly?
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Not really. I'm sure the people at the Black Cat have been using this board for ages to tap into our hipster vibes. LOL. But seriously, I'm only half kidding. ;) This board is a great asset to finding out what the paying public really want and will pay to attend.
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Wouldn't bother me either way. It's not as if Libertine posted the thread to hype the site. Hell, Markie, you started the thread!
As pretty major fans of live music, I'd think we'd be pretty jazzed with getting some of the inside scoop. If it's a tool that works, great, if not, then I'll ignore it.
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I too like having a say. I'm just worried about any spamming.
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There you go, Jag, using those "-ster" descriptors!
;)
Originally posted by Jaguär:
Not really. I'm sure the people at the Black Cat have been using this board for ages to tap into our hipster vibes. LOL. But seriously, I'm only half kidding. ;) This board is a great assest to finding out what the paying public really want and will pay to attend.
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I'm sure John Ashcroft and the Rand Corporation are somehow wrapped up in this.
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Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
I'm sure John Ashcroft and the Rand Corporation are somehow wrapped up in this.
Oh, and you are forgetting SRI and TRW. ;)
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Originally posted by bags:
Hell, Markie, you started the thread!
yes and I think the idea is a good one.
I just wondered if they did web searches for everytime their name was mentioned, or if they found they topic fortuitously, i.e via a friend.
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A company that expects to go anywhere needs to know its target market. Checking out an internet chat board is a good place to start.
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but if they checked the chatboards it would take a lot of time, and they found the topic very quickly. It would be more economical for the company to post a topic on the chatboard than to wait and see if one ever turned up, dont you think?
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Do we know what Thirsty really does for a living?
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Does it bother you that people read what you post on this board and use it for marketing purposes? Yes, it would be more economical.
Originally posted by Bubba:
but if they checked the chatboards it would take a lot of time, and they found the topic very quickly. It would be more economical for the company to post a topic on the chatboard than to wait and see if one ever turned up, dont you think?
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Judging from the data I've accumulated, you most likely enjoy Kraft Macaroni and Cheese.
Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
Do we know what Thirsty really does for a living?
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I hate to break up the highly entertaining speculation about how I ended up posting to this thread, but we are neither as devious nor as astute as various members have guessed. In a start-up business you do not have the time to Google yourself every day to see what people are saying about you (and a passworded board like this won't show up in most search engines anyway).
Wednesday afternoon our business development guy was on the phone with the 9:30 discussing the possibility of putting the TourVote button on this site. The 9:30 person happened to mention to him that this thread had sprung up on their board. Without that pointer--or some other third-party tip--we would never have known about it.
Our guy then e-mailed this news the rest of us. I went to the site, registered so I could read what was being said, decided that a couple of misconceptions or mysteries might deserve clarification, and you can read the rest above.
I do want to add that it is extremely helpful to see the comments of the people we want to serve, whether supportive or critical. In the long run it enables us to do a better job. I wish I had time to do more of it.
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Originally posted by bags:
Liberte...who is involved? (You may not be able to say, but that is the lingering question).
And has it been useful? -- I see that it's been around for a while.
TourVote is a service provided by Demand ID Systems, a start-up company based in the Baltimore/Washington area. There's no secrecy surrounding who we are--it's really just us. We have no connection (at this time, anyway) with the established music industry except for having some very knowledgable industry folks serving (unpaid) on our Board of Advisors. Interested persons with time on their hands are invited to check out the company web site: DIDS home page (http://www.demandid.com)
As to whether it's useful, the answer changes every day. The more music lovers who cast TourVotes for the acts they'd buy a ticket to see, the more useful it will become. We have been around for a while, building out our infrastructure, but only since August have we been adding local area partner sites to carry the voting application. So the data's pretty thin for making show placement decisions, although a couple of venues now have hundreds of ballots from their own site visitors. It'll be a lot more powerful when we have 50K to 100K local fans involved, which is our goal.
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Originally posted by Jaguär:
I too like having a say. I'm just worried about any spamming.
Please, if you have concerns (and we understand why you might) read our privacy policy before you vote: TourVote privacy policy (http://tourvote.com/privacy.html)
We mean it, too. Selling you up the river to spammers would be the kiss of death for our business, even if we weren't concerned about the ethics involved. Which we certainly are, whether one chooses to believe us or not.
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I think the really important question here, Liberte, is what's your taste in music like?
The success of your company hinges on your response.
Kidding. (?)
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Originally posted by walkman:
I think the really important question here, Liberte, is what's your taste in music like?
The success of your company hinges on your response.
Kidding. (?)
Heh heh. The answer to your question is, "most of the above."
If you looked at my CD/vinyl (I'm old enough to have been a legal drinker at the original Woodstock, which I was) collection without my telling you anything, you would probably guess that I started at one end of a big-ass Tower Records and took one item every 12 inches down every aisle, possibly without looking at them, until I had covered the entire store. Okay, maybe I skipped a few sections, but not many.
It would be the same mishmash for ticket stubs, too. In the last year or so you'd find something like 2 classical, 20 or so various flavors of indie rock, 4 classic rock, 15 or so folk/alt-country/Americana (sorry, I'm too ignorant to know where the official lines are there) 3 bluegrass, 3 jazz, and 2 blues events. And an off-Broadway musical. No hip-hop unless you count a little attempted crossover by whiteboys in the indie rock area. My bad, should learn how to listen to that stuff but just haven't had the time.
Authentically made music is good regardless of where it comes from or who does it, if you take the time to get inside it. I hate it when people slag artists because they're too popular or not cool. Only thing that counts is, can they move you? If not, is it really their fault, or yours?
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Authentically made music is good regardless of where it comes from or who does it, if you take the time to get inside it. I hate it when people slag artists because they're too popular or not cool. Only thing that counts is, can they move you? If not, is it really their fault, or yours?
whoa
I'm at least going to hire this guy to post on the Forum for me
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You hiring?
Originally posted by Liberte:
Authentically made music is good regardless of where it comes from or who does it, if you take the time to get inside it. I hate it when people slag artists because they're too popular or not cool. Only thing that counts is, can they move you? If not, is it really their fault, or yours?
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bilge
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Originally posted by Edsall Park:
Originally posted by Liberte:
...it is extremely helpful to see the comments of the people we want to serve[..]I'm old enough to have been a legal drinker at the original Woodstock???
This dubious/spurious mofo was old enough for Vietnam, too !
Is this disinformation, or what? I knew this was hippie crap (http://www.badmovies.org/movies/billyjack/billyjack3.wav) from the gitgo...Just another ex-flower-child who now works for big brother, looking for faster ways to sell you food that isn't really whole. [/b]
Liberte, don't mind this guy up here, whatever name he chooses to use at the time. This is why we keep him locked up in cyberspace. He gets a little goofy when the seasons change. It's usually thought of as Seasonal Affective Disorder. He's harmless, actually. :D :D :D
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Originally posted by Liberte:
In a start-up business you do not have the time to Google yourself every day to see what people are saying about you (and a passworded board like this won't show up in most search engines anyway).
I do want to add that it is extremely helpful to see the comments of the people we want to serve, whether supportive or critical. In the long run it enables us to do a better job. I wish I had time to do more of it.
I didn't think Google would be able to find a thread on a BB. And I agree with you, we're your target audience and, in the hopes that you're mission is as stated -- to bring the music to the people who want to see it, I'm happy for you to pick my brain! I probably see 40 - 80 shows a year, so goodness knows, I'm ripe for the picking!
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Originally posted by Liberte:
Originally posted by walkman:
I think the really important question here, Liberte, is what's your taste in music like?
The success of your company hinges on your response.
Kidding. (?)
(1)....15 or so folk/alt-country/Americana (sorry, I'm too ignorant to know where the official lines are there)...
(2)....Authentically made music is good regardless of where it comes from or who does it, if you take the time to get inside it. I hate it when people slag artists because they're too popular or not cool. Only thing that counts is, can they move you? If not, is it really their fault, or yours? [/b]
(1) Oh, stick around here, you'll have lots of volunteers to set you straight! Though the debate will go on and on and on.
(2) Wow, pretty open minded. Again, there are folks here who'll be happy to set you straight that this music sux or that artist is a worthless sellout or that genre has NEVER been any good. But, again, to be followed with never ending debate. Especially if you start talking about Wilco.
;)
Welcome!
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Originally posted by thirsty moore:
[QB] You hiring?
Sure, but standard pay scale for everyone right now (unfortunately including moi) is $0.
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Originally posted by Edsall Park:
Originally posted by Liberte:
...it is extremely helpful to see the comments of the people we want to serve[..]I'm old enough to have been a legal drinker at the original Woodstock???
This dubious/spurious mofo was old enough for Vietnam, too !
Is this disinformation, or what? I knew this was hippie crap (http://www.badmovies.org/movies/billyjack/billyjack3.wav) from the gitgo...Just another ex-flower-child who now works for big brother, looking for faster ways to sell you food that isn't really whole. [/b]
I believe you and everyone else here would be old enough for Vietnam, too. Last time I checked a world map it was still there. Help yourself.
BTW, we are not in the food business, whole or otherwise. Sorry you had such a hard time deciphering our company description. We'll put the writers back on it Monday.
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Originally posted by Liberte:
Originally posted by thirsty moore:
[QB] You hiring?
Sure, but standard pay scale for everyone right now (unfortunately including moi) is $0. [/b]
Where are you located?
DC, probably. :roll: Like all the other good stuff.
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Originally posted by bags:
I didn't think Google would be able to find a thread on a BB. And I agree with you, we're your target audience and, in the hopes that you're mission is as stated -- to bring the music to the people who want to see it, I'm happy for you to pick my brain! I probably see 40 - 80 shows a year, so goodness knows, I'm ripe for the picking! [/b][/QUOTE]
Thanks. As I mentioned, it's a big help. Also kind of fun digging around the other threads here to see what is on peoples' minds, too.
Now, what about the very large number of fans (40 to 80 million just in the US) who are into music enough to spend serious time tracking it on the 'Net, but who see maybe 1 - 4 live shows a year? (Not the maybe 1 - 4 million like you who see 40 to 80 shows.) How do we get them into the picture? Because if the artists and venues and promoters and the rest of [jargon alert] the live music industry value chain can figure out how to get THOSE guys out to one or two more shows a year, it does a lot more to solve their very serious economic problems than trying to beat more money out of you guys.
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Originally posted by Jaguär:
Originally posted by Liberte:
Originally posted by thirsty moore:
[QB] You hiring?
Sure, but standard pay scale for everyone right now (unfortunately including moi) is $0. [/b]
Where are you located?
DC, probably. :roll: Like all the other good stuff. [/b]
The senior founder is from Balmer. Rest of us work out of basement offices scattered between there and DC. Our conference room is a string of local (mostly Montgomery County) pubs and cheap eats joints.
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Originally posted by Liberte:
The senior founder is from Balmer. Rest of us work out of basement offices scattered between there and DC. Our conference room is a string of local (mostly Montgomery County) pubs and cheap eats joints.
Gee, wonder if I know him (or her)? I'm stuck up here (Balt) myself. :roll: One of these days I'll make a break for it. Every time I try, it falls through.
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I found Tourvote on Music Monthly.com (http://www.musicmonthly.com). It would work for venues like Black Cat or Velvet Lounge. The 930 club wouldn't need such a site. So, how does the booking for the 930 club?
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Originally posted by Liberte:
Now, what about the very large number of fans (40 to 80 million just in the US) who are into music enough to spend serious time tracking it on the 'Net, but who see maybe 1 - 4 live shows a year?
Do all these people live in Iowa? I mean, I don't understand how a self-respecting music fan could only make it to 3 shows a year. Unless those three are Kiss, Aerosmith and Poison, in which case, I can't imagine an indie startup company is going to help them much. It seems to me that the service only really works as a method for letting the club owners know what the kids (or aged hipsters) are into (ie. when The Cooper Temple Clause git their limey arses over here, the Black Cat better be ready and willin')...but if that's what you want, reading Pitchfork is free.
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Originally posted by walkman:
Originally posted by Liberte:
Now, what about the very large number of fans (40 to 80 million just in the US) who are into music enough to spend serious time tracking it on the 'Net, but who see maybe 1 - 4 live shows a year?
Do all these people live in Iowa? I mean, I don't understand how a self-respecting music fan could only make it to 3 shows a year. Unless those three are Kiss, Aerosmith and Poison, in which case, I can't imagine an indie startup company is going to help them much. It seems to me that the service only really works as a method for letting the club owners know what the kids (or aged hipsters) are into (ie. when The Cooper Temple Clause git their limey arses over here, the Black Cat better be ready and willin')...but if that's what you want, reading Pitchfork is free. [/b]
Walkman, you and I may understand what they are missing, but either those millions of other fans don't, or they don't care, or they have their own reasons for not getting out to live shows very often. They aren't all in Iowa, for certain. What their level of self respect is I have no idea, but I've never seen any research to suggest it's a particular problem with them.
I didn't open the topic, by the way, as a pretext for touting our solution. The lethargy (or disinterest, or fear, or whatever the hell it is) of fans who claim to like stuff but won't get off their tush to go see it is a huge problem across the arts, not just for indie rock, or for music. I would *love* to know more about why those guys behave differently from you or me. I understand some obvious reasons why people in certain demographic strata (e.g., working parents of young children) don't get out as much as, say, young urban singles. But even within strata there appear to be wide ranges of behavior--so there are other factors at work.
Finally, just knowing "what they like" doesn't tell you "what they'll do and buy." That's why the TourVote process is slanted towards putting you on a notification list for concert tickets, not just running a popularity contest. We're not kidding ourselves that this twist enables us to fix the industry's woes all by ourselves, but the nonparticipation rates are so high that we can do them a big favor just by making a small dent.
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Originally posted by Liberte:
Finally, just knowing "what they like" doesn't tell you "what they'll do and buy." That's why the TourVote process is slanted towards putting you on a notification list for concert tickets, not just running a popularity contest. [/QB]
Hmmm...good point. It's as if Pollstar started taking requests. Methinks that I like it.
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So Liberte, I brought up the topic. I think it is a fine idea.....
I have a couple of thoughts.
Well a lot of people dont go to shows because they dont get to hear new music because radio is shite.
People who dont go to concerts regularly dont check concert listing regularly, so bands that they would go and see remain unnoticed by them. Your site may help with something like that a little especially if it supplied info of nearby shows, even if they were not in the suppliers home city. But it would probably help to be able to supply a list of bands to you, rather than one at a time.
Another thought, where do you expect this project to go. My fallacy of the excluded middle mind, suggests you will either fade into obscurity, or in a couple of years you will have the next boy band on TRL saying, "if you want to see us live in your city, vote for us on tourvote.com, NOW.....
Thanks for the interesting insights you have given so far.
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bilge
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Originally posted by Marumsco Hills:
Originally posted by Liberte:
I believe you and everyone else here would be old enough for Vietnam, too. Last time I checked a world map it was still there. Help yourself.
My family already saw enough of that lousy country, while you were, doubtless, out on a student deferment. (http://www.kcbx.net/~rloomis/drag33.wav) Who died in your place so you could have the honor today of shilling this worthless crap, huh? You obviously have a lot in common with Dick Cheney. [/b]
Dick Cheney would be mighty pissed if he found out you were saying that.
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Originally posted by Bubba:
....
Well a lot of people dont go to shows because they dont get to hear new music because radio is shite.
....
People who dont go to concerts regularly dont check concert listing regularly, so bands that they would go and see remain unnoticed by them. Your site may help with something like that a little especially if it supplied info of nearby shows, even if they were not in the suppliers home city. But it would probably help to be able to supply a list of bands to you, rather than one at a time.
Another thought, where do you expect this project to go. My fallacy of the excluded middle mind, suggests you will either fade into obscurity, or in a couple of years you will have the next boy band on TRL saying, "if you want to see us live in your city, vote for us on tourvote.com, NOW.....
Very good points, Bubba. And yes, credit (and my thanks) are due to you for starting the topic. What I should have said above was that I introduced the *subtopic* of music fans who don't attend live shows out of curiosity regarding their motivations or lack thereof, and yada yada yada--didn't intend to claim ownership of the whole thread.
Homogenized radio content controlled by Big Music is definitely a factor. There is some good broadcast out there, but it's so marginalized (low power, underpromoted) that it doesn't help much. In the mass market things like Music Choice, Sirius, and XM may at least open up a few ears. The biggest opportunity for new music exposure, though, is the Internet. Among Internet Radio, the artist showcase sites, P2P, and artists' own sites there has been a manyfold increase in the availability of new music to consumers, AND THEY ARE GOING FOR IT. However, it hasn't yet translated into a proportional increase in live show attendance.
One thing that several people have mentioned that I need to clarify is that we are not a destination site. We have two sites for early-stage marketing purposes, but we don't want people to get in the habit of going there to vote or plan their nightlife. We want to provide a new piece of interactive, fan-involving functionality to all kinds of music information sites. That is where we believe the best chance is to intercept both hard-core live music fans and the people who think about seeing live shows but don't currently act on the urge very often. We want *those* sites to prosper, not to pull their traffic away. The more fans they get jazzed up about music--new or old--the better off we are. We'll be content to do the behind-the-scenes work of building the ticket notification lists, feeding the demand information into the value chain, and prodding fans to get out to the shows.
Excellent point about the value of entering band lists. The way we do it right now is to session-cookie the zip code and e-mail info you enter while voting. After you've voted, you can open the vote window again (on the same host site) and the ballot form will be prepopulated with that data--just enter the next band name on your concert wish list. Lather, rinse, repeat, for as many artists as you want to get TourAlerts for (when we start doing the alerts later this fall).
As to where we expect to go, our fate really is in the hands of the fans. We hope participation will beget more participation as music fans talk to each other. Despite our own preferences for more challenging music (all the DID folks are serious music junkies), we are agnostic as to the genres and flavors of music those 80 million fans want to see. If they like boy bands, we want them to GO SEE boy bands, because the excitement of live performances can be habit-forming. Long ago and far away, I used to listen to pure dreck and think the Delta Blues was unbearable. You listen--really listen, as you *must* in a live show--your tastes expand. We'd love it if every band in the world would encourage their fans to go vote for them on a TourVote partner site (*not* TourVote.com), because (a) it would level out the self-promotion effect on the data and (b) it would start many of those fans down the road to becoming more frequent concert-goers.
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Who pays for TourVote?
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Originally posted by ggwâ?¢:
Who pays for TourVote?
Currently, nobody. We are in the give-it-away-to-build-awareness stage. Eventually, people in the live music value chain will pay for a decision support application that slices, dices, and packages the information in useful ways (something like Pollstar, as Walkman deduced). There are also other ways the music industry can pay us for access to the information. Those don't include the ability to spam TourVoters. All currently envisioned services to voters will be free.
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bilge
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bilge
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Originally posted by Marumsco Hills:
This button (http://holdthebutton.com/) should be on their site too!
I'll be sure to let you know when we start hiring for the product development group. :D