930 Forums
=> GENERAL DISCUSSION => Topic started by: Thousand Made-Up Loves on September 06, 2011, 11:20:59 pm
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1. Matt Cameron - Arguably one of the best rock drummers to ever live. Cameron playing PJ is like him performing on cruise control compared to his Soundgarden work. His fills are impeccable. I could watch a Matt Cam for every concert he ever played in. Also, Evacuation and Cropduster are underrated songs. In fact, Cameron was a big influence on Riot Act and that is why RA is one of my favorite PJ albums.
2. Jack Irons - Jack really brought a great rhythm and style to the band that helped expand their horizons. No Code and Yield wouldn't have been the same without him. Who You Are and In My Tree just wouldn't have been the same with Dave A.
3. Dave A - The man who helped the band break onto the scene. Likely got a raw deal from Ed. Brought great power and energy and a "punk" sense of drumming to the band. And for fuck's sakes, he's got a stickman tattoo. I always think of Dave when I hear State of Love and Trust and Brother.
4. Chad Krusen - Hey, the guy who performed on Ten will always have a special place in a PJ fan's heart.
Been on a major PJ kick tonight for the first time in years after listening to their PJ20 bootlegs. NEVER...GETS...OLD. So many fantastic memories.
PJ Album Rank:
1. No Code
2. Riot Act
3. Vitalogy
Honorable mention: (not in any order) Vs., Yield, Backspacer
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I'd agree with your rankings. Matt's the best. Not only does he really adapt well to their changing sound and fit the modern day Pearl Jam more than Dave A or Jack Irons would, he also writes some killer songs ("The Fixer," "Evacuation," "You Are," "In The Moonlight," "Cropduster," "Johnny Guitar"). I totally agree with you that those songs are heavily underrated, and I was thrilled to see "Moonlight" in Wisconsin this past weekend.
Cameron, however, does NOT fit the band as well on the Jack Irons live stuff. The opening to "In My Tree" (my favorite PJ song) sounds like "Hot For Teacher" with Cameron on the drums. :(
Irons was great, but I can't imagine the band's sound continuing to evolve in the direction it has with him on drums. He was a major part of their best record (No Code), and it should stay that way.
Dave A. was great in his own way. He did write "Go." But listening to their early stuff, it's hard not to imagine him beating the shit out of the drums on every song. "Daughter" sounds like it's begging for a softer touch. He was excellent for their early 90's attitude.
It's Dave Krusen, right? I don't know if you got a bit of a Nickelback thing in mind there. :)
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My album rankings:
1.) No Code
2.) Binaural
3.) Ten
4.) Vitalogy
5.) Yield
6.) Riot Act
7.) Backspacer
8.) Vs.
9.) Pearl Jam
No Code will always be special for me. I was 14 when it came out, and it was such a different sound for the band, but it immediately hit me as something magical. "In My Tree," "Present Tense," and "Smile" are unlike anything else they've ever done.
I've tried to rank other stuff higher than Ten, but it's just so damn good. You KNOW nothing from Riot Act - which I love - is as good as "Release."
Binaural is a fucking awesome record. I was shocked they didn't play a single song from it at PJ20.
Yield is weird for me. It has some amazing tracks like "Faithfull" and "Pilate" and "All Those Yesterdays" but it feels so overproduced. And songs like "MFC" and "Do the Evolution" sound soooo much better live.
I really want to rank Backspacer above Riot Act, but I don't like that the second half of the record sounds WAY too much like Eddie solo stuff. "Speed of Sound," "Unthought Known," and "The End" are obviously Ed songs that don't sound they have much input from Mike or Stone. Riot Act is one of my favorites. It has such a great flow but because of that, there aren't a whole lot of standouts. I think my favorite might be "1/2 Full" or "Cropduster."
The self-titled record sounded too much like they were trying to spark some of their older sound. It's too forced. And songs like "Marker in the Sand" and "Big Wave" are kind of forgettable.
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some real pearl jam expertise here...
I can only say that Cameron rules.
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Drummer rankings is hard to argue with. Vitalolgy was always my favorite PJ release.
Never completely understood why Dave A. was kicked out of the band. The reasons I heard seemed awfully hypocritical.
Matt is the man but I much prefer him in Soundgarden.
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What was the one with all the hits on it? That one.
Is this a joke? Pearl Jam released albums after "Vitalogy?" Well, push me over with a feather!
Pearl Jam is to the US what Oasis is to England. Discuss.
I think with any band the technical competency of the drummer is inversely propotional to how good they are.
1. This is why the Rolling Stones are always great.
2. This is why Rush have always sucked.
3. This is why most people only care about the first three Pearl Jam albums.
Once a band fires their original drummer(s) and gets one "who can play our more mature, challenging material", it's all over. The band slowly starts climbing up their own ass. Case in point: Pearl Jam. Another case in point: Oasis. They peaked with their first album and first six singles. "Wonderwall?" Brushes. It's James Taylor!
4. Guns N Roses. They swung with Adler.
5. R.E.M. Bill Berry.
6. Husker Du. Grant Hart.
7. Nirvana. I much prefer "Bleach." Although, I think I'm the only person alive who thinks Dave Grohl is a shitty drummer. And Taylor Hawkins is even worse.
8. Oh. White Stripes. Meg White.
Q.E.D.
Brian
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the beatles fired their first drummer.
they went nowhere after that.
you lose.
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Actually, Mumford & Sons have shown that drummers (and bass guitarists) are completely surplus to requirements when producing incredible original music.
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the beatles fired their first drummer.
they went nowhere after that.
you lose.
I'm sure there isn't an eye-rolling Smiley big enough for this but this is what I honestly believe. The only aspect of the Beatles I like is the Hamburg Beatles. No one believes me but my favorite Beatles song is their cover of Chuck Berry's "Rock N Roll Music." The screaming. Lennon being ahead of the beat. THAT's punk. Which is cooler? This?:
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-CD1Zm02PwUI/Ta7o8iyTSLI/AAAAAAAAAa8/R1bTYZMFHlw/s1600/beatles-magical-mystery-tour.jpg)
or this?:
(http://www.beatlesbible.com/images/beatles/beatles_indra_club.jpg)
Q.E.D.
Brian
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Quit tarding up my fucking thread, Brian. Jesus Christ.
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Matt Cameron is clearly the best PJ drummer, but I agree about his drumming live on In My Tree. Still, it was pretty awesome to hear at PJ20.
While I have love for Jack Irons, he was always a temporary member to me, despite his part in bringing Eddie together with Stone and Jeff. Dave A. will always have a special place in my heart because he was playing with them the first time I saw them in 1991. Dave K. is a non-entity to me, even though he played on the first album. Aren't you all forgetting that Matt Chamberlin played with them when Dave K went into rehab??? He was in the Alive video, but no recordings other than early live recordings I suppose.
No Code is one of my favorite albums, and Ten and Pearl Jam are tied for second.
I'm a Pearl jam junkie.
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Quit fucking up my bro thread, Brian. Jesus Christ.
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Quit tarding up my fucking thread, Brian. Jesus Christ.
Fine. Which is cooler. This:
(http://www.antiquiet.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/pearl-jam-468x351.jpg)
or this? (Plus, who's the lesbian on the left?):
(http://media.bonnint.net/la/0/39/3964.jpg)
Answer? Neither. Neither are cool.
Brian
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Lesbian on the left!!!
**spits coffee on computer screen**
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Naw, just an annoying-to-watch guitar player.
Lesbian on the left!!!
**spits coffee on computer screen**
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What was the one with all the hits on it? That one.
Is this a joke? Pearl Jam released albums after "Vitalogy?" Well, push me over with a feather!
Pearl Jam is to the US what Oasis is to England. Discuss.
I think with any band the technical competency of the drummer is inversely propotional to how good they are.
1. This is why the Rolling Stones are always great.
2. This is why Rush have always sucked.
3. This is why most people only care about the first three Pearl Jam albums.
Once a band fires their original drummer(s) and gets one "who can play our more mature, challenging material", it's all over. The band slowly starts climbing up their own ass. Case in point: Pearl Jam. Another case in point: Oasis. They peaked with their first album and first six singles. "Wonderwall?" Brushes. It's James Taylor!
4. Guns N Roses. They swung with Adler.
5. R.E.M. Bill Berry.
6. Husker Du. Grant Hart.
7. Nirvana. I much prefer "Bleach." Although, I think I'm the only person alive who thinks Dave Grohl is a shitty drummer. And Taylor Hawkins is even worse.
8. Oh. White Stripes. Meg White.
Q.E.D.
Brian
White Stripes drummer = best. But you forgot the Velvet Underground. I agree that adler was much better than his predecesor.
Oh and Pearl Jam has had 4 drummers? I guess Eddie Vedder is hard to get along with.
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Dave A. was great in his own way. He did write "Go."
Where did you read that? I noticed on, say, allmusic that all the Vs. songs are listed to the full band. Compared to Vs., the songs on Ten are pretty obvious. Ed did the lyrics, Stone did a few songs, Ed wrote Porch himself, etc. It would be interesting to learn who else primarily wrote the songs that are attributed to the entire band.
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Never completely understood why Dave A. was kicked out of the band. The reasons I heard seemed awfully hypocritical.
Conventional wisdom is that Dave A wanted to be a rock star and live the rock star life while the band was huge and Ed (and supposedly the rest of the band) wanted to recede from the spotlight and become more artsy. I've never been big on reading unauthorized biographies about bands, but I believe that is the case. Jack Irons has basically been very sick his whole life, and so he could only fill in for a few albums before Cameron took over.
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It would be interesting to learn who else primarily wrote the songs that are attributed to the entire band.
God it's been a long time, but if I remember correctly "Release" was the only song attributed to the entire band on Ten, and when I purchased the guitar tab book (before tabs were freely available on the internet...), "Release" was not available in the book with a disclaimer about not being able to establish all the rights. I always assumed they couldn't work a deal out with Dave K...
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Dave A. was great in his own way. He did write "Go."
Where did you read that? I noticed on, say, allmusic that all the Vs. songs are listed to the full band. Compared to Vs., the songs on Ten are pretty obvious. Ed did the lyrics, Stone did a few songs, Ed wrote Porch himself, etc. It would be interesting to learn who else primarily wrote the songs that are attributed to the entire band.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(Pearl_Jam_song) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(Pearl_Jam_song))
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vs._(Pearl_Jam_album) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vs._(Pearl_Jam_album))
Dave A. wrote most of "Go" and collaborated with Jeff on "W.M.A." (no surprise there). He was also a big part of "Last Exit."
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Once a band fires their original drummer(s) and gets one "who can play our more mature, challenging material", it's all over. The band slowly starts climbing up their own ass. Case in point: Pearl Jam. Another case in point: Oasis. They peaked with their first album and first six singles. "Wonderwall?" Brushes. It's James Taylor!
Other than the obvious singles, Definitely Maybe is pretty unlistenable now due to the ham fisted embarrassedly bad drumming. Oasis began to suck, because Noel was at best an average songwriter who clearly wasn't find anymore inspiration while watching tv.
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Other than the obvious singles, Definitely Maybe is pretty unlistenable now due to the ham fisted embarrassedly bad drumming.
What the hell are you talking about? "Digsy's Dinner" or "Slide Away" are embarassing to listen to now because of their drumming?!?! You're trying to tell me they'd be greatly improved if Steve Gadd played on them? That's like saying the Ramones would have been better with a better drummer.
Brian
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Dave A. was great in his own way. He did write "Go."
Where did you read that? I noticed on, say, allmusic that all the Vs. songs are listed to the full band. Compared to Vs., the songs on Ten are pretty obvious. Ed did the lyrics, Stone did a few songs, Ed wrote Porch himself, etc. It would be interesting to learn who else primarily wrote the songs that are attributed to the entire band.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(Pearl_Jam_song) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(Pearl_Jam_song))
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vs._(Pearl_Jam_album) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vs._(Pearl_Jam_album))
Dave A. wrote most of "Go" and collaborated with Jeff on "W.M.A." (no surprise there). He was also a big part of "Last Exit."
Cool, thanks for sharing. So who wrote Dirty Frank?
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Other than the obvious singles, Definitely Maybe is pretty unlistenable now due to the ham fisted embarrassedly bad drumming.
What the hell are you talking about? "Digsy's Dinner" or "Slide Away" are embarassing to listen to now because of their drumming?!?! You're trying to tell me they'd be greatly improved if Steve Gadd played on them? That's like saying the Ramones would have been better with a better drummer.
Brian
What do the Ramones or Steve Gadd have to do my opinion that the drumming on 1st Oasis album makes it unlistenable. Oh wait one isn't allowed to a differing opinion to the almighty you...
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Other than the obvious singles, Definitely Maybe is pretty unlistenable now due to the ham fisted embarrassedly bad drumming.
What the hell are you talking about? "Digsy's Dinner" or "Slide Away" are embarassing to listen to now because of their drumming?!?! You're trying to tell me they'd be greatly improved if Steve Gadd played on them? That's like saying the Ramones would have been better with a better drummer.
Brian
The Ramones would've been better with a better everything.
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Other than the obvious singles, Definitely Maybe is pretty unlistenable now due to the ham fisted embarrassedly bad drumming.
What the hell are you talking about? "Digsy's Dinner" or "Slide Away" are embarassing to listen to now because of their drumming?!?! You're trying to tell me they'd be greatly improved if Steve Gadd played on them? That's like saying the Ramones would have been better with a better drummer.
Brian
The Ramones would've been better with a better everything.
oh shut up.