930 Forums
=> GENERAL DISCUSSION => Topic started by: kosmo vinyl on November 03, 2005, 01:05:00 pm
-
Are real trouble! Lets hope this latest flap hits them really hard where it counts in the bottom line.
WaPo overview (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/11/sony_raids_hack.html)
-
The part of this thats priceless is that not only does the software one has to install in order to listen to the cd leave ones's Windows system open for potential viruses, hackers, etc. It actually slows the system down in order to keep track of when you pop a Sony/BMG CD into listen to it.
-
Once the gig was up, Sony released an update to reveal the hidden files. Note that is doesn't add an uninstall feature though. Amazing.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/02/AR2005110202362.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/02/AR2005110202362.html)
-
Originally posted by vansmack:
Once the gig was up, Sony released an update to reveal the hidden files. Note that is doesn't add an uninstall feature though. Amazing.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/02/AR2005110202362.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/02/AR2005110202362.html)
and requires the use of Internet Explorer to run... and doesn't fix the potential security holes.
Another priceless quote about this software.
But according to Mikko Hypponen, director of research for Finnish antivirus company F-Secure Corp., users who want to remove the program may not do so directly, but must fill out a form on Sony's Web site, download additional software, wait for a phone call from a technical support specialist, and then download and install yet another program that removes the files.
Hypponen agreed that Sony's software could help hackers circumvent most antivirus products on the market today. He added that installing the Sony program on a machine running Windows Vista -- the beta version of the next iteration of Microsoft Windows -- "breaks the operating system spectacularly."
More info from WaPo (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/02/AR2005110202362.html)
Considering what it's going to cost Sony to handle all these support requests they'll wont break even on the sale of these CDs.
-
I laughed at that too, but mostly because he said "spectacularly."
The truth is, I haven't found too many programs that are stable on Windows Vista.
-
and it gets better :D
World of Warcraft hackers using Sony BMG rootkit
Published: 2005-11-03
Want to cheat in your online game and not get caught? Just buy a Sony BMG copy protected CD.
World of Warcraft hackers have confirmed that the hiding capabilities of Sony BMG's content protection software can make tools made for cheating in the online world impossible to detect. The software--deemed a "rootkit" by many security experts--is shipped with tens of thousands of the record company's music titles.
Blizzard Entertainment, the maker of World of Warcraft, has created a controversial program that detects cheaters by scanning the processes that are running at the time the game is played. Called the Warden, the anti-cheating program cannot detect any files that are hidden with Sony BMG's content protection, which only requires that the hacker add the prefix "$sys$" to file names.
Despite making a patch available on Wednesday to consumers to amend its copy protection software's behavior, Sony BMG and First 4 Internet, the maker of the content protection technology, have both disputed claims that their system could harm the security of a Windows system. Yet, other software makers that rely on the integrity of the operating system are finding that hidden code makes security impossible.
http://www.securityfocus.com/brief/34 (http://www.securityfocus.com/brief/34)
-
Glad I never played my Foo Fighters in my cd-rom.
-
EFF took the time to read the 3,000 word end-user license agreement (aka "EULA") that comes with these disc...
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/004145.php (http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/004145.php)
Now the Legalese Rootkit: Sony-BMG's EULA
November 09, 2005
If you thought XCP "rootkit" copy-protection on Sony-BMG CDs was bad, perhaps you'd better read the 3,000 word (!) end-user license agreement (aka "EULA") that comes with all these CDs.
First, a baseline. When you buy a regular CD, you own it. You do not "license" it. You own it outright. You're allowed to do anything with it you like, so long as you don't violate one of the exclusive rights reserved to the copyright owner. So you can play the CD at your next dinner party (copyright owners get no rights over private performances), you can loan it to a friend (thanks to the "first sale" doctrine), or make a copy for use on your iPod (thanks to "fair use"). Every use that falls outside the limited exclusive rights of the copyright owner belongs to you, the owner of the CD.
Now compare that baseline with the world according to the Sony-BMG EULA, which applies to any digital copies you make of the music on the CD:
1. If your house gets burgled, you have to delete all your music from your laptop when you get home. That's because the EULA says that your rights to any copies terminate as soon as you no longer possess the original CD.
2. You can't keep your music on any computers at work. The EULA only gives you the right to put copies on a "personal home computer system owned by you."
3. If you move out of the country, you have to delete all your music. The EULA specifically forbids "export" outside the country where you reside.
4. You must install any and all updates, or else lose the music on your computer. The EULA immediately terminates if you fail to install any update. No more holding out on those hobble-ware downgrades masquerading as updates.
5. Sony-BMG can install and use backdoors in the copy protection software or media player to "enforce their rights" against you, at any time, without notice. And Sony-BMG disclaims any liability if this "self help" crashes your computer, exposes you to security risks, or any other harm.
6. The EULA says Sony-BMG will never be liable to you for more than $5.00. That's right, no matter what happens, you can't even get back what you paid for the CD.
7. If you file for bankruptcy, you have to delete all the music on your computer. Seriously.
8. You have no right to transfer the music on your computer, even along with the original CD.
9. Forget about using the music as a soundtrack for your latest family photo slideshow, or mash-ups, or sampling. The EULA forbids changing, altering, or make derivative works from the music on your computer.
So this is what Sony-BMG thinks we should be allowed to do with the music on the CDs that we purchase from them? No word yet about whether Sony-BMG will be offering a "patch" for this legalese rootkit. I'm not holding my breath.
-
did the new my morning jacket CD have this issue? it's an ATO / RCA / BMG / Sony release, and i ripped it on my PC but didn't notice anything like this
-
Originally posted by HoyaParanoia:
did the new my morning jacket CD have this issue? it's an ATO / RCA / BMG / Sony release, and i ripped it on my PC but didn't notice anything like this
The MMJ disc uses a different type of copy protection.
But that new Celine Dion disc you just bought is totally infected.
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/004144.php (http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/004144.php)
-
I tried the MMJ cd at work and the Sony/BMG EULA complete with "the software" came up immediately.
When I tried it on my laptop to see what I got, nothing came up at all. I have itunes working on that machine; not sure what difference it makes if any, but no message all the same.
-
Originally posted by HoyaParanoia:
did the new my morning jacket CD have this issue? it's an ATO / RCA / BMG / Sony release, and i ripped it on my PC but didn't notice anything like this
ripped on home and work pcs just fine
-
A suit was filed in Europe yesterday.
-
soon . . . eight tracks and cassettes, re-rule the world.
-
Originally posted by walkonby:
soon . . . eight tracks and cassettes, re-rule the world.
and those can't be copied or ripped?
no soon record companies will realize that not all record buyers are criminals...
-
Originally posted by vansmack:
A suit was filed in Europe yesterday.
and one was filed in california earlier this week, and one is supposedly gonna be filed in new york state soon.
-
Always good to see in a Saturday paper....
Sony halts anti-piracy software
Hackers can exploit secret copy-protect program in CDs
- Carrie Kirby, Chronicle Staff Writer
Saturday, November 12, 2005
Sony BMG said it has temporarily stopped manufacturing music CDs containing a controversial copy-protection program after several Internet viruses took advantage of the software to attack computers.
"We are aware that a computer virus is circulating that may affect computers with XCP content protection software," the company said in a statement Friday, referring to the secret program Sony included in some of its music CDs that would download itself onto hard drives unbeknownst to many customers.
Aside from stopping the production of CDs with the problematic program, the company said it will "re-examine all aspects of our content protection initiative to be sure that it continues to meet our goals of security and ease of consumer use."
Sony has been criticized and sued by customers over the program, which was designed to slow music piracy by limiting the number of times a CD can be copied.
Many customers were angry that the program hides itself on computers where the CD is played and is difficult to remove without damaging the computer. Computer security experts warned that the technology the program uses to hide deep in the Windows operating system could open the door to dangerous Internet viruses.
As predicted, several viruses have begun piggybacking on the Sony program to attack computers, antivirus firms said Friday. Like most viruses infecting computers in the past year, the malicious programs are designed to take over computers and make them part of zombie networks, or botnets, that can be used to send spam or attack Web sites.
However, because the viruses will infect only computers whose owners happen to have bought and installed a Sony CD with this form of copy protection, they do not present a major security threat, anti-virus experts said.
"There's no reason to belive that this is going to be a huge problem," said David Cole, senior director of antivirus firm Symantec's Security Response team. He estimated that about 100 computers worldwide may have been infected with these viruses.
Without mentioning Sony by name, Homeland Security official Stewart Baker warned entertainment companies not to let their efforts to fight piracy endanger their customers.
"It's very important to remember that it's your intellectual property, it's not your computer," the Associated Press quoted Baker as saying at a piracy conference. "And in the pursuit of protection of intellectual property, it's important not to defeat or undermine the security measures that people need to adopt in these days."
Sony has not said how many CDs with the program have already been sold or remain on store shelves. A phone call to a Sony spokesman Friday went unanswered. San Francisco's Electronic Frontier Foundation has identified 19 affected CDs, from a variety of artists including Neil Diamond, Celine Dion, Switchfoot and others.
The company has made a patch available on its Web site that removes the virus risk associated with the program. Anti-virus companies said their software can detect and remove the risky part of the program.
"We're glad Sony has stopped manufacturing the CDs, but they aren't out of the woods yet," said Jason Schultz, staff attorney for the foundation, which helped call attention to the problem recently. He called on Sony to recall the CDs it has already shipped, help people fix problems the program has caused and to disclose how many CDs and what titles carry the program.
"Simply halting production is like Exxon saying they will no longer ship oil along the Alaskan coast, but refusing to clean up the spills (that) have occurred," Schultz wrote in an e-mail to The Chronicle.
The first virus seen Thursday was ineffective and may have been designed to call attention to the weakness of Sony's program, antivirus experts said. But subsequent viruses that appeared Thursday and Friday looked like run-of-the-mill attempts to take over computers in search of illicit profit.
Virus writers sometimes embed messages in the code of a malicious program. When viruses or other attacks are carried out to send a political message, it's known as hacktivism.
"Certainly, there's nothing in the code ... thanking or cursing Sony," Cole said. "This didn't smack of hacktivism in any way."
Anti-copying systems have become more common on compact discs as music companies try to stem flagging sales, blamed in part on piracy. But the effort has been a struggle, because some anti-copying technologies have been easy to thwart and others, like this one, have angered customers.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Controversial music software
What it's for: To prevent widespread CD copying from cutting into music sales.
The problems: The software can open up computers to virus risks or other problems, and attempting to remove it may damage the PC.
Which CDs? Sony BMG releases with the software include Trey Anastasio's "Shine," Celine Dion's "On ne change pas," Neil Diamond's "12 Songs" and Van Zant's "Get Right With the Man."
Web resources:
Sony answers questions about the software and offers a security patch: cp.sonybmg.com.
Mark's Systinternals Blog explains the problems with the software: www.sysinternals.com/blog. (http://www.sysinternals.com/blog.)
-
You know, it really ought to be a crime to modify someone else's computer without their knowledge or consent, just like any other form of willfully damaging someone else's property is.
http://www.alex.to/doomlink (http://www.alex.to/doomlink)
-
It looks like SunnComm the other company that Sony uses for copy protecting CDs is working on MAC software. It can be found if one pokes around on the CD. because MACs don't have the autorun feature it hard to say how these extensions are going to get installed, but they are out there. need to look at the mac hd at home and see whats on there...
http://us.gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/sony-mac-rootkit-136702.php (http://us.gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/sony-mac-rootkit-136702.php)
-
The XPC copy protection which is getting all the attention these days has a sibling produced as mentioned above by Sunncomm. It's the protection used on My Morning Jacket, BRMC, etc..
Well it too is Spyware and of concern.
http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=925 (http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=925)
-
Let's face it. Autorun should now be considered a security risk that exposes those who have it enabled to all manner of cyberbogyemen. Firewall and security programs should by default shut off autorun. Autorun is dead; may it burn in digital hell.
-
Nice. Thanks a lot Sony Music.
Sony's decision to include rootkit-like copy restrictions on some of its music CDs is prompting some companies to review whether they allow their staff to use personal CDs at work.
Last week, Trojan horses emerged that avoid detection by using the digital rights management, or DRM, software used by Sony BMG Music Entertainment on some of its audio CDs. This software uses the same techniques used by rootkit malicious software to hide itself from the operating system, which makes it particularly difficult to detect.
Andrew Yeomans, vice president of global information security at Dresdner Kleinwort Wasserstein, said that he is already assessing whether the Europe-based investment bank needs to tighten up its controls.
"I'm reviewing the autorun settings for music CDs, but not planning to ban their use," Yeomans said. "We certainly don't want arbitrary software to be installed."
Yeomans added that the bank cannot prevent all its employees from running executable programs from a CD or download. That's because some people have to be given administrator rights to use certain applications, which would allow them to override such restrictions.
Richard Starnes, president of the Information Systems Security Association, said that other companies should consider whether they need a policy on CD use.
"This is certainly something that would trigger a review of policies. I would advise companies to review the situation," Starnes said.
"If it's solely a Sony issue, it is easier for a company to make a decision that it will not allow particular Sony CDs. But if it becomes widespread, then it becomes difficult to decide what CDs are allowed or not allow," added Starnes, who was speaking before Sony announced it had stopped producing CDs containing the rootkit-like software, called XCP.
Other companies have confirmed that they are also watching the situation closely.
"Something that can get in and hide itself would have the security people screaming their heads off," said the capacity manager at one major financial firm, who asked to remain anonymous.
"Up until now, they thought that audio CDs are safe. I think that will change, and I wouldn't be surprised if every major bank changed their policy. The fact that this software can be used to hide other stuff means that the possibilities for getting at customer data are horrendous," he added.
Opposition to Sony's behavior has been fierce, with threats of boycotts and even legal action.
Ingrid Marson and Graeme Wearden of ZDNet UK reported from London.
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-5951177.html?tag=nl.e589 (http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-5951177.html?tag=nl.e589)
-
i'm guessin that sony's stockholder meeting is going to be more entertaining then some of their cd releases...
the amount of money sony will lose over the fallout as result of trying to prevent piracy will be more than if they had just left well enough alone...
-
It gets better and better... The "uninstaller" for the XPC software which kicked off the current furvor can cause even more security problems when run.
wapo update (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/11/multiple_securi.html)
-
If I was one of the artist's with a release using this shit I'd be right pissed. This is so far from over. Burn sony burn.
-
a swap is in the works... of course i want a free ps2 or psp to go along with my new cds. and chaz is right the artists are the ones getting screwed bigtime over this...
a bigger fear is that sony will sell off the record companies to one of the other majors and create even less competition, meaning more DRMed crap, etc. thankfully, the backcatalog stuff hasn't been touched by this stuff, but it's only a matter of time.
link (http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/technology/2005-11-14-sony-cds_x.htm)
-
And if copy protecting CDs isn't enough, there was a recent Sony patent that would enable them to allow a game to only be played on the console it was first loaded into. i.e. eliminating sharing renting or buying used games. Speculation is that it's could show up in PS3s. This sure could cause problems with all the stores selling used games, on one hand they could refuse to carry new ps3 hw and games to make a stand or get screwed by the competition who don't give a rats ass about the used game market.
Would gamers take a stand against such protection or continue as if it's a nonissue..
Sony really is an aggrogent establishment..
-
Its still under investigation but there is evidence that Sony in their attempt to copy protect their own material, infringed on the license that LAME encoding DLL was released under by not properly giving credited for using it within the their program. in the words of Dr. Doom "Fuckers!"
-
*insert random crybaby comment about Sony here*
-
ok more whining then... smackie has probably been following this one closer than i, but it would appear that the next generation of DVD technology that Sony is pushing for, Blu-ray, is even more anti-consumer than what we have now.
personally copy protection doesn't really effect me, it's not like i need to make archival copies of dvds, and with cd's it just limits where i can listen to them. no file sharing or pirate internet radio stations here as i don't fancy getting caught and having to pay those fuckers seeing as i'm home owner with assets.
DRM technology is fine for online music services like Napster, Yahoo, etc, that allow you to preview music. I don't buy into the consumer friendly line some tout about the iTunes Music Store. IMHO it's no bargin and come with a DRM anchor. Maybe it's just me, but most of the CDs bought don't suffer from the only one track is good syndrome. It's either the entire CD is great or crap, so I'm not out searching for that one elusive track.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
personally copy protection doesn't really effect me,
And yet 2/3rds of the posts in this thread are from you...
-
i'm pointing it out for those who may have let the Sony XPC software be installed on thier PCs and the subsequent problems it's causing people.
while copy protection dosen't effect me, it dosen't mean i like it.
-
hey, i appreciate your outrage and keeping us up to date, kosmo ...
in cases like this, outrage from the public is NECESSARY, otherwise sony will just keep on keepin on ... i'm constantly surprised at how much weight sustained and organized public outcry has against corporation greed, negative letters and good boycotts really can help ... complete difference (in my mind) from protesting public policy issues
-
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
*insert random second grade sex joke here*
-
I've admittingly been spending to much time reading blogs and comments on this issue, most of which I agree with. However, I always grin at those who claim that record companies are out dated in the internet age and will soon go out of business. That the internet has levelled the playing field and any artist/band can get thier product out there and succeed. To which I say yeah right....
Of the thousands of CD released each year, which ones have the biggest sales? Those released by majors or thier imprints. Record companies have the marketing muscle, promo departments, and distribution networks to get product into peoples hands. If any artist wants to break out of the sub 100K sales they'll need to be with some sort of record company major or indie.
Myspace is touted a method of bands not needing record labels to push their product. So does having 10s of thousands fans signed up as a friend of the band translate into sales? What about the other 10,000+ bands who have pages on myspace, what kind of sales are they going to get by going direct to the consumer. Myspace just put out a cd with 17 of those 10,000 band of those. It still required to work with Interscope to get it to the marketplace. So when do the other bands get their chance in the spotlight.
Right or wrong labels serve as filters and have the capability to sell what the people want or think they need.
The part of the record industry which should change is the amount of control artists have over thier careers and product. Artists should be treated as free agents from the get go, being able to have control of thier masters from the start, and moving from company to company.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
The part of the record industry which should change is the amount of control artists have over thier careers and product. Artists should be treated as free agents from the get go, being able to have control of thier masters from the start, and moving from company to company.
This is the most ridiculously "fight-the-power-i'm-out-of-touch-with-reality" thing I've ever read on this board. And Rhett posts here.
-
why? Established artists take thier catalog to different labels, why shouldn't developing artist be granted the same priveldge.
More and more artists are licensing their masters to record companies it should become standard pratice.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
why? Established artists take thier catalog to different labels, why shouldn't developing artist be granted the same priveldge.
First, artists, when they start out, are "free agents" as you put it. They are not tied down to a record label until they choose to sign a contract. God forbid people honor their decisions. If a label is going to front for recording and touring advances and yadda yadda yadda, why should the artist be allowed to simply jump ship the second they garner any popularity?
-
Most recording contracts are loan agreements anyways for a set number of records. My point is that artist should be given to the options to have shorter contracts, and if they meet the obligations of the contract be free to move. Bands on smaller labels are bought out by bigger labels. Bands also have the ability to produce thier records and shop them around to the label willing to license them at the most favorable terms.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
My point is that artist should be given to the options to have shorter contracts, and if they meet the obligations of the contract be free to move.
Imagine I'm a hockey player for a second. I want to play for the Detroit Red Wings. The Red Wings will pay me $2 million/year for 5 years. This is unaccepatable, I want more per year, and think as I improve, I should be able to get even more, so I don't want a 5 year deal, I want two (so I can get a better deal 2 years from now). Additionally, the Red Wings wear Nike, and I want to wear CCM.
What do I do? Do I protest and demand the Red Wings offer me a different contract? Do I cite the inherent "unfairness" of what they're offering? No, I pass on playing for a top-rate organization and I go play for the Toronto fucking Maple Leafs. I think you see my point.
-
no because there is difference between signing a licensing agreement and signing a recording contract.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
there is difference between signing a licensing agreement and signing a recording contract.
Oh, really? Never mind then.
-
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
Toronto fucking Maple Leafs.
Shouldn't it be the "Toronto fucking Maple Leaves"?
-
Originally posted by ggw?:
Shouldn't it be the "Toronto fucking Maple Leaves"?
Everyone they had who was any good left, so yeah, "leaves."
-
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
Imagine I'm a hockey player for a second. I want to play for the Detroit Red Wings. The Red Wings will pay me $2 million/year for 5 years. This is unaccepatable, I want more per year, and think as I improve, I should be able to get even more, so I don't want a 5 year deal, I want two (so I can get a better deal 2 years from now). Additionally, the Red Wings wear Nike, and I want to wear CCM.
It's called "renegotiation" and it happens all the time - more so in professional sports than anywhere else probably. And if arbitrators get involved, all bets are off. Just watch the TO saga unfold and what the players union are going to do. It will amaze you when the Eagles won't be allowed to keep TO on the bench despite continuing to pay him.
-
Originally posted by vansmack:
It's called "renegotiation" and it happens all the time - more so in professional sports than anywhere else probably.
I get what you're saying, but it's not - it's negotiation, since there was no contract yet to renegotiate.
My point is, if a band wants a record label that can throw around the promotion $$/advances a major label can, then they have to agree with some possibly unsavory terms (long contracts, etc.). If the length of the contract and ownership of the back catalogue's masters is most important to a band, they might have to sign to an indie label. It's called you can't have your cake and eat it too.
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
smackie has probably been following this one closer than i, but it would appear that the next generation of DVD technology that Sony is pushing for, Blu-ray, is even more anti-consumer than what we have now.
Both of the new standards are going to have DVD style encryption to stop piracy, and add a new technology called Advanced Access Content System (AACS). The actual defense mechanism hasn't been decided yet, but one alternative being discussed is having your Blu-Ray or HD-DVD player sign on to the internet to detect the legitimacy of your disc, thus not allowing copies to play.
However, the Blu-Ray disc is also going to add another feature called ROM-Mark watermarking technology, but nobody's really sure what it's going to do. The thought is that only original discs will have this watermark and if you put in a disc that doesn't have this watermark but the movie file looks for it, the disc won't play. All speculation though.
-
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
I get what you're saying, but it's not - it's negotiation, since there was no contract yet to renegotiate.
You're missing the point, but I have to go to lunch and can't explain it fully.
Think of it this way: in sports, rookie contracts are structured for all rookies, and the adjustments are made through signing bonuses depending on where you were drafted. If you succeed early in your career, your employer will renegoiate a longer term deal to keep you happy, and keep you on their team longer. K-rod is signed for three more years at a reduced rate, but there is no way the Angels aren't going to renegotiate his deal to sign him to a longer deal and give him his just value. And he'll likley stay with the Angels much longer. But if you aren't making the grade, the rules force the Angels to release you, so guys like Turnbow and Jenks can get a second chance with another team. That's all Kosmo's saying (I think).
-
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
Originally posted by vansmack:
It's called "renegotiation" and it happens all the time - more so in professional sports than anywhere else probably.
I get what you're saying, but it's not - it's negotiation, since there was no contract yet to renegotiate.
My point is, if a band wants a record label that can throw around the promotion $$/advances a major label can, then they have to agree with some possibly unsavory terms (long contracts, etc.). If the length of the contract and ownership of the back catalogue's masters is most important to a band, they might have to sign to an indie label. It's called you can't have your cake and eat it too. [/b]
Why not... I'll bet more artists are gettin' wise to major label record company tactics. You can bet that if a band like the Arcade Fire wanted to make the step up to a major and get a potential big boost in sales, they'll license future records for either a set period of time or copies with renewal or walk-away clauses built in. The major still seeking to make money will have to emphasize more manufacturers and marketers to survive. The playing field is leveling out, but major still hold whats required to sell big. Artist need to be smarted about their product, and not get locked into situations where thier label own everything they record whether they choose to release it or not.
-
And this is why the major recording industry is just totally freaked out by what Arctic Monkeys has gone and done. Totally bypassed them and scored it big on the charts. Welcome to 2005 RIAA.
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
Originally posted by vansmack:
It's called "renegotiation" and it happens all the time - more so in professional sports than anywhere else probably.
I get what you're saying, but it's not - it's negotiation, since there was no contract yet to renegotiate.
My point is, if a band wants a record label that can throw around the promotion $$/advances a major label can, then they have to agree with some possibly unsavory terms (long contracts, etc.). If the length of the contract and ownership of the back catalogue's masters is most important to a band, they might have to sign to an indie label. It's called you can't have your cake and eat it too. [/b]
Why not... I'll bet more artists are gettin' wise to major label record company tactics. You can bet that if a band like the Arcade Fire wanted to make the step up to a major and get a potential big boost in sales, they'll license future records for either a set period of time or copies with renewal or walk-away clauses built in. The major still seeking to make money will have to emphasize more manufacturers and marketers to survive. The playing field is leveling out, but major still hold whats required to sell big. Artist need to be smarted about their product, and not get locked into situations where thier label own everything they record whether they choose to release it or not. [/b]
-
Sony's Non-apology which downplays the numerous risks their software has caused, especially if one had run thier "un-installer" program.
Personally, I expect a message with happy ending when exchanging my CDs.
http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/ (http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/)
To Our Valued Customers:
You may be aware of the recent attention given to the First4Internet XCP content protection software included on some SONY BMG CDs. We have learned that the software includes a feature that may make a user's computer susceptible to a virus written specifically to target the software.
We share the concerns of consumers regarding discs with XCP software, and we are instituting a program that will allow consumers to exchange any CD with XCP software for the same CD without copy protection. We also have asked our retail partners to remove all unsold CDs with XCP software from their store shelves and inventory. We will make further details of this program available shortly.
We deeply regret any inconvenience this may cause our customers and we are committed to making this situation right. It is important to note that the issues regarding these discs exist only when they are played on computers, not on conventional, non-computer-based CD and/or DVD players.
Our new initiatives follow the measures we have already taken, including last week's voluntary suspension of the manufacture of CDs with the XCP software. In addition, to address security concerns, we provided to major software and anti-virus companies a software update, which also may be downloaded at http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/english/updates.html. (http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/english/updates.html.) We will shortly provide a simplified and secure procedure to uninstall the XCP software if it resides on your computer.
Ultimately, the experience of consumers is our primary concern, and our goal is to help bring our artists' music to as broad an audience as possible. Going forward, we will continue to identify new ways to meet demands for flexibility in how you and other consumers listen to music.
-
and it would appear Sony/BMG and EMI are still committed to including some kind of copy protection on all cds issued next year.
-
I don't see a Artic Monkey's success story happening anytime soon in America, seeing as they themselves have signed to a major label in order reach these shores. A deal worth 725K pounds... The Bravery are close but still required the support of a major label to reach a wider audience.
Even in England after Artic Monkey were able to create the hype for themselves, they stilled signed with Domino who are at the moment a red hot independent label. With artists like Franz Ferdinand on board. UK radio is much more open to UK indle labels.
I think it would be great for an independent artist to crack the big time sales wise in the US, just don't see it happening anytime soon.
-
Nice little pigeon hole they've gotten themselves into.
They can't release an uninstall unless they're willing to forgo thier top artists being played on PCs, which most teens use to play their music.
But if they don't uninstall, they've left millions of computers vulnerable to a virus and they are liable.
I love it.
And who, of all people, comes to the consumers rescue?
On Saturday, a Microsoft engineering team indicated that it would be updating the company's security tools to detect and remove parts of the Sony BMG copy-protection software to help protect customers.
-
yes but which company invented the autorun feature which is what most of the copy protection programs take advantage of... seeing as most consumers don't even know how to turn it off, bypass it, or not run in admin mode. just asking... ;)
and why Internet Explorer required to be used to run the uninstaller? because an active-x component was written that was also lazily left behind.
-
and if anything Apple and iTunes is coming to consumers side, by not supporting the Sony/BMG copy protection software and forcing them to provide instructions on how to get around it.
-
I wasn't defending MS, I just thought it was odd that they jumped at the chance to remove the software considering the files Sony's software creates are WMA's using MS DRM.
And the only reason Apple didn't support it was because Sony opted to use WMA (Apple did submit a bid). If Sony said AAC with iTunes DRM, you can bet Apple would have supported it.
-
no your right it was odd for Micro$oft to come out so publicly and quickly in regard to the issue... but it is odd that Micro$oft didn't get on Sony's case earlier on this issue, seeing as it must have caused some user errors before being uprooted.
-
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10069563/ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10069563/)
-
Sony has finally released the list of CD which have the XCP copy protection on them. Is it complete?
ARTIST ALBUM
A Static Lullaby - Faso Latido
Acceptance - Phantoms
Amerie - Touch
Art Blakey - Drum Suit
The Bad Plus - Suspicious Activity?
Bette Midler - Sings the Peggy Lee Songbook
Billy Holiday - The Great American Songbook
Bob Brookmeyer - Bob Brookmeyer & Friends
Buddy Jewell - Times Like These
Burt Bacharach - At This Time
Celine Dion - On Ne Change Pas
Chayanne - Cautivo
Chris Botti - To Love Again
The Coral - The Invisible Invasion
Cyndi Lauper - The Body Acoustic
The Dead 60's - The Dead 60's
Deniece Williams - This Is Niecy
Dextor Gordon - Manhattan Symphonie
Dion - The Essential Dion
Earl Scruggs - I Saw The Light With Some Help From My Friends
Elkland Golden
Emma Roberts - Unfabulous And More: Emma Roberts
Flatt & Scruggs - Foggy Mountain Jamboree
Frank Sinatra - The Great American Songbook
G3 - Live In Tokyo
George Jones - My Very Special Guests
Gerry Mulligan - Jeru
Horace Silver - Silver's Blue
Jane Monheit - The Season
Jon Randall - Walking Among The Living
Life Of Agony - Broken Valley
Louis Armstrong - The Great American Songbook
Mary Mary - Mary Mary
Montgomery Gentry - Something To Be Proud Of: The Best of 1999-2005
Natasha Bedingfield - Unwritten
Neil Diamond - 12 Songs
Nivea - Complicated
Our Lady Peace - Healthy In Paranoid Times
Patty Loveless - Dreamin' My Dreams
Pete Seeger - The Essential Pete Seeger
Ray Charles - Friendship
Rosanne Cash - Interiors
Rosanne Cash - King's Record Shop
Rosanne Cash - Seven Year Ache
Shel Silverstein - The Best Of Shel Silverstein
Shelly Fairchild - Ride
Susie Suh - Susie Suh
Switchfoot - Nothing Is Sound
Teena Marie - Robbery
Trey Anastacio - Shine
Van Zant - Get Right With The Man
Vivian Green - Vivian
-
so how does one go about getting an exchange copy?
-
don't believe that has been announced yet... will fully monitor the situtation
-
Sony's Fix for CDs Has Security Problems of Its Own (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/16/AR2005111602242.html)
By Brian Krebs
Special to The Washington Post
Thursday, November 17, 2005; D01
Consumers who used computers to listen to Sony BMG music CDs containing flawed software were still exposed to potentially crippling security breaches yesterday, experts said, as the company continued to try to fix the problem.
Sony BMG Music Entertainment released a software patch earlier in the week, but experts warned that the fix created as many security problems as the original program, and as of yesterday the company had not come up with a new approach.
Sony BMG has recalled nearly 5 million CDs equipped with the flawed anti-piracy software shipped to retailers over the past eight months -- including titles by singers Neil Diamond, Celine Dion and Ricky Martin. Roughly two weeks ago, security experts showed that the software automatically installed a program that hid all of its files from users and damaged or crashed computers of customers who tried to remove it.
When played on a home computer running Microsoft Windows, the CDs require users to install a special media player and click "agree" on 3,000-word license agreement. But the agreement makes scant mention of what the software, which is designed to prevent people from making unauthorized copies of the music, will do once installed.
For example, experts showed that the anti-piracy software "phones home" to Sony BMG and to the company that created the software, First 4 Internet Ltd., with details of user's music-listening habits. It also interferes with more than 250 programs that could allow copying of the CD contents to a portable media player or backup disc.
Detailed examination of the license agreement reveals no mention of such activity.
Further testing proved that hackers could use the program's file-hiding capabilities to silently embed computer viruses on PCs, prompting Sony BMG to issue a software update that removes that feature. Days later, unknown attackers sent millions of junk e-mails containing a virus crafted to exploit the flaws and seize control of vulnerable computers.
After the virus outbreaks, Sony BMG -- a joint venture of Sony Corp. and Bertelsmann AG -- said it would suspend production of new CDs featuring the copy-protection technology. But after nearly two weeks of relentless consumer backlash, Sony BMG said Tuesday that it would recall all CDs equipped with the anti-piracy software and that roughly 2 million customers who have already bought the discs would be able to exchange them.
Sony BMG spokesman John McKay declined to comment beyond the company's written statement, which apologized to customers for any inconvenience caused by the software and promised additional details about the CD exchange program in coming days.
Hours after Sony BMG announced its buyback, researchers at Princeton University found that even the patch the company released to remove the anti-piracy software contains security problems. The patch leaves behind coding that allows any Web page the user visits to download, install and run programs on the computer. Other research, released Tuesday by Atlanta-based Internet Security Systems, showed that the underlying program itself contained security holes that hackers could use to attack Windows computers running the software.
Sony BMG's latest moves have not erased its legal and public relations troubles. Last week, an attorney in California filed a lawsuit seeking damages for residents who bought the defective CDs, and on Monday, a lawyer in New York filed a nationwide class-action case against the company.
Mark Russinovich, chief software architect at Sysinternals, the security expert whose initial research into the anti-piracy program sparked the controversy, welcomed the class-action suits, saying withdrawal of the software wasn't enough.
"What I'm most concerned about is: If nothing serious happens to Sony that's visible to other companies, then we run the risk of this kind of thing becoming standard corporate behavior," Russinovich said.
The incident raises new questions about how far the music industry can go to defend its works from piracy. The industry loses roughly $4.2 billion worldwide to piracy each year, according to the Recording Industry Association of America. The software was the latest effort by entertainment companies to rely on controversial "digital rights management" (DRM) technologies to reverse a steady drop in sales that the industry attributes in large part to piracy facilitated by online music and movie file-sharing networks such as Kazaa and LimeWire.
Microsoft Corp. also waded into the fracas last week when it labeled Sony BMG's software a threat, saying it would let users remove the program through its anti-spyware program. Starting in December, Microsoft said, it will automate the removal of the software through its "malicious software removal tool," a program designed to help users clean up their computers after virus infections.
-
I am so glad that Sony's taste in music if far different from mine! As much as I tend to like many of their products, I certaintly hope that this hurts their bottom line in a very deep way. In fact, so deep that other companies learn a nasty lesson about this crap.
On the retributive justice side, I bet that when all is said and done, this will end up costing Sony more $$$ than all of the music that they are so convinced they would lose sales on due to copying and/or sharing. It's just a shame that the artists got involved whether they wanted to or not.
What really scares me about this kind of crap is that I generally use my computer to listen to real official CDs. It's one thing getting stung after you've downloaded something on a p2p but should be criminal to fuck up someone's computer or other devices when everything is done on the up and up by the consumer.
Too bad Metallica isn't on Sony.
-
i would really like to stop buying sony, but i have a fucking PS2 and about 15 games, most of which i still enjoy playing ... looks like i'm stuck ...
-
Those pesky CDs can be returned! (http://www.upsrow.com/sonybmg/)
Brian Krebs over at the Post is out in front on reporting this one. His Security Fix blog will be one I'll be reading for the time being.
http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/11/sony_bmg_has_ju.html (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/11/sony_bmg_has_ju.html)
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
Those pesky CDs can be returned! (http://www.upsrow.com/sonybmg/)
Sweet. Dropping The Dead 60's in the mail today.
-
Kosmo wrote: "Right or wrong labels serve as filters and have the capability to sell what the people want or think they need. "
The only filter my friends who are signed with major labels see is the filter that sucks up all the profits. Even somewhat successful bands get charged back by their labels for tour expenses, like hotel rooms. Thus, many opening acts you'll see at places like the 930 are still scrimping and looking to crash at friends' houses so they don't get charged back in towns where they have peeps. Nice filtering, right?
-
Originally posted by kosmo vinyl:
Its still under investigation but there is evidence that Sony in their attempt to copy protect their own material, infringed on the license that LAME encoding DLL was released under by not properly giving credited for using it within the their program. in the words of Dr. Doom "Fuckers!"
It's starting to look more and more like they did. (http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-5960222.html?tag=nl.e589)
-
It would appear that Sony's DRM partners can't do anything right. The "uninstaller" for the discs with the SunnComm copy protection also leaves people open for malicious attacks over the internet. And the SunnComm DRM crap is more widely used than the XPC shite. i.e. My Morning Jacket, BRMC, Sloan, etc, etc, Full list in the comments of the this story (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/11/the_sony_bmg_an.html#comments) or at SunnConn's web page (http://www.sunncomm.com/support/askthetech.asp)
Be aware that the SunnComm crapola appears to be loaded on ones computer before you get a chance to accept the EULA or not. SunnConn is also hard at work at creating DRM software that works on Macs.
-
Amazon offers refunds (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4448788.stm)
-
One of those pesky Sony BMG XCP CDs would make a perfect holiday gift for a pesky co-worker, if you've been appointed as their personal "secret Santa".
-
i wonder if the promo copies of those cds contained the program.
-
Originally posted by Venerable Bede:
i wonder if the promo copies of those cds contained the program.
Why, are you starting to get a bit paranoid about that Celine Dion disc you just downloaded?
-
4:1 odds that vansmack owns this infected disc:
<img src="http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B000BKDO8O.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg" alt=" - " />
-
Originally posted by ggw?:
4:1 odds that vansmack owns this infected disc:
Oh no! Please don't tell my wife or I will certainly be an owner by the end of the weekend.
-
Ouch.
Texas is seeking $100K per violation in their State from Sony. (http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-5964995.html?tag=nl.e589)
-
Now that the XPC brand of DRM protection has been shown to be problematic and resulted in a product replacement offer. More attention has been focused on the MediaMax software, that comes on lots more CDs. It will in fact load it's software on a computer even if you decline the EULA when inserting the disk. I smell even more trouble for the execs over at Sony/BMG...
http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=936 (http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=936)
-
Even more problems with the other copy protection software SonyBMG uses... This time at least Sony admitted to the problem up front, there is also a new "fix" for those who installed the XCP crapola on their PCs, although I would wait a day or two before running it, let the experts test it.
SunnConn Crapola story at Cnet (http://news.com.com/New%20Sony%20CD%20security%20risk%20found/2100-1002_3-5984764.html?part=rss&tag=5984764&subj=news)
Brian Krebs WaPo Blog entry (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/12/sunncomm_patche.html#comments)
Sony hearts Mediamax (http://sonybmg.com/mediamax/)
The CDs with the MediaMax "copy" protection sw include
Black Rebel Motorcycle Club "Howl"
My Morning Jacket "Z"
David Gray "Life In Slow Motion"
Full List (http://sonybmg.com/mediamax/titles.html)
If you have ever put one these CDs into a computer running Windows you may want to update the software. It has been shown that even if you decline the End User Agreement that appears when loading the CD, the software can still be installed without your consent down the line.
This copy protection SW affect six million sold CD, Sony must be shitting themselves at the thought of having to replace all of those.
New fix info for XCP (i.e. Dead 60's, The Coral)
WaPo Blog (http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2005/12/sony_issues_too.html)
Sony XCP uninstaller (http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/english/updates.html)
-
Well it didn't take long... stay away from the latest "fix" for those MediaMax "protected" CDs.
http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=942 (http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=942)
my recommendation is stay the hell away from the XCP "fix" as well for a bit...
-
funny stuff
How to make your own copy protected CD for holiday giving (http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=946)
-
the artists strike back...
Sony Artists offering home-burned CDs to replace spyware-infected discs
Sony refuses to recall CDs infected with Sunncomm's MediaMax spyware, so some artists are running their own recall programs, offering home-burned CDs to fans who complain that the software prevents them from ripping their CDs.
Artist managers have been vocal in their opposition to the use of copy-protection software. "I just don't think that this is the answer to the problem that they think exists," says the manager of one veteran artist affected by the XCP software. Mike Martinovich, manager for My Morning Jacket, says that even before the revelation of MediaMax's security problems, his company had been mailing burned, unprotected copies of MMJ's new album Z to fans who complained that MediaMax prevented them from transferring songs to their iPods. "It should have been enough that fans are annoyed," he says. "But this should be the final reason."
Rolling Stone Story (http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/8950981?rnd=1134568264547&has-player=true)
-
Interesting read:
http://www.emailbattles.com/archive/battles/security_aacejifdhf_ic/ (http://www.emailbattles.com/archive/battles/security_aacejifdhf_ic/)
Smart computer users know that once a computer is infected by a rootkit, it's changed forever. And as Windows rootkits go, Hacker Defender is among the most dangerous. The author of Hacker Defender, holy_father, explains why he does what he does, and what you can do to detect his rootkit.
Don't know that I agree with him, but it was definitely intriguing.
-
Sony settles lawsuit over the copy protected CDs... Does cover everyone who bought those disks or only in states where Sony was sued. Regardless, I for one am looking forward to getting my $15 back, can't say I could ever find 6 titles to download.
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/963aaecc-7bb1-11da-ab8e-0000779e2340.html (http://news.ft.com/cms/s/963aaecc-7bb1-11da-ab8e-0000779e2340.html)
Sony BMG settles suits over ??flawed?? music CDs
By Andrew Edgecliffe-Johnson in London
Published: January 2 2006 17:11 | Last updated: January 2 2006 17:11
Sony and BMGSony BMG has put the biggest of its legal challenges behind it.
The music company has settled a series of class-action lawsuits stemming from its use of software that was intended to prevent illegal copying of its CDs but left customers?? computers vulnerable to viruses and other attacks.
Ending a year in which it has been shaken by bad publicity surrounding the digital rights management software, the music company offered free music downloads and agreed to stop making CDs with the offending XCP or MediaMax software.
The company also agreed to bring in an independent auditor to confirm to customers it has not and will not use their personal data.
Sony BMG produced 4.7m CDs containing the software, of which nearly 3m were sold. It will pay an undisclosed amount for the recall of affected discs, and will also bear the cost of compensating members of the class-action suits.
Consumers who bought any of the 52 titles with XCP software will receive replacement copies and the choice of two compensation packages: a cash payment of $7.50 and one free album download; or three free album downloads. Users of the MediaMax software will receive a free download.
Lawyers for the plaintiffs welcomed the settlement, which the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a digital free-speech advocacy group, said would ??provide significant benefits for consumers who bought the flawed CDs?.
The copy protection problem emerged after a security researcher revealed on his blog that a Sony BMG CD had installed a ??rootkit? ?? tools used by hackers to disguise their presence ?? on his computer.
-
Where do we sign up to get our $7.50?
-
shrug
-
Some analysis of the Sony BMG Rootkit lawsuit settlement, but no mention of how to get in. Includes a list of 175 titles one will be able to download for free, with very little of interest but including oddly enough the only Rockpile CD released. Those owning the MediaMax copy protected CD, i.e. BRMC, get one non-DRMed download.
http://sonysuit.com/ (http://sonysuit.com/)
Is this the "best" 175 they have to offer? (http://sonysuit.com/classactions/michaelson/downloadlist.pdf)
-
anyone get thier replacement discs yet? mine arrived today without copy protection and just for giggles and grins i even ripped them into iTunes on a Windoze machine. To bad it cost Sony millions of dollars in order to prevent me from listening to the cd on my puter.
-
http://www.eff.org/sony/ (http://www.eff.org/sony/)
The settlement process has begun in EFF's class action lawsuit against Sony BMG for the flawed digital rights management (DRM) that Sony BMG released in millions of CDs over the last several years.
Music fans who bought the affected CDs can submit claims for clean music.
Many customers are also eligible for extra downloads or a small cash settlement.
-
Having already replaced my rootkit inflected CDs, I got my settlement paperwork for those. The list of DRMed downloadable CDs on offer is pretty dismal...