Author Topic: COVID-19 2020  (Read 495862 times)

Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3780 on: December 20, 2021, 05:11:10 pm »
I don’t mind having opinions challenged - I would hardly say they are ideas- but I do mind sarcasm and condescension.

Not sure why Sweetcell felt triggered.

I get that it’s been a bed of roses keeping kids home for those that can hire their own personal teachers for their kids but it’s good to think beyond yourself.

And no I don’t think most local, state and national governments have done much so far beyond going along with the recommendations of the public health officials. I believe most government is fairly chaotic, disfunctional, and expensive.


Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3781 on: December 20, 2021, 05:18:12 pm »
But Sweetcell sort of embodies the general mindset among liberals. Anyone that so much as lifts a peep against the prevailing orthodoxy on how society handles covid is mocked.

We have had 21 months of this and even if we went along with things, observed all the recommendations, wore the masks and got fully vaccinated if we should now say “Hey we have vaccines , maybe it’s not as deadly anymore, the costs do pile up and become harder to bear with longer term consequences” then one must expect to be treated with disdain….one’s motives to be questioned… one must simply do as one is told
« Last Edit: December 20, 2021, 05:21:28 pm by Starsky »

grateful

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3782 on: December 20, 2021, 06:08:18 pm »
MD data is back up. 10% positivity.

https://coronavirus.maryland.gov/

Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3783 on: December 20, 2021, 07:29:47 pm »
UK had close to 91,000 new cases reported today with 44 deaths.




vansmack

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3784 on: December 20, 2021, 08:57:37 pm »
that is an excellent rebuttal to the points i made.  i will have to reconsider my position based on the arguments you present. 

40 years ago the guy was student body president, so you know, he's got a resume.
27>34

Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3785 on: December 20, 2021, 09:03:28 pm »
that is an excellent rebuttal to the points i made.  i will have to reconsider my position based on the arguments you present. 

40 years ago the guy was student body president, so you know, he's got a resume.


“The guy”? Me?

Really? I did get a photocopier for the students to use!

But I didn’t mean it as a humblebrag…more like that I got along ok with others… which wasn’t always easy going to an international school with different groups from different places








Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3786 on: December 20, 2021, 09:19:25 pm »
how many years do they need to stay home? Forever?

don't be a drama queen.  the last lockdown wasn't forever (and in this country, it wasn't even really a lockdown). 





-Drama Queen? I think it’s been a big deal. My father in law died. We couldn’t see him the last few months. Of course the nursing home wouldn’t let us see him and then we know what happened

Why couldn’t it last forever? If the virus is around forever and mutates who knows?

- the last lockdown or whatever you want to call it meant no school for my kids for part of a year and almost a full year. I don’t want to say too much more personal cause some seem to derive joy from using things against one but there were other impacts







"what?  i have to take a BATH?!?  how long to do i have to stay in the tub, FOREVER?!?!?!111"
 
- seems immature on your part…this is what you mean about a debate?






And how likely is it my fully vaccinated kids would get covid and die from school? I mean it must be infinitesimal!

you do realize how societies work, right?  just because something doesn't apply 100% to you, personally, doesn't mean it's not the right thing for a society to do.

- What is with the condescension man? Just make your points and spare me that
- I didn’t mean my kids specifically fool…I meant fully vaccinated people
- actually now we are at a point where we need to prioritize the interests of the vaccinated…if we can’t compel people to get vaccinated we can certainly move on
from them…



It’s just so moronic…

agreed
 
- ?





the failure to balance all the costs with the benefit… as if a case of covid for a fully vaccinated person who wears masks to school is automatic death…

do you seriously think that policy makers did not consider the costs and benefits of various mandates before declaring them?  "oh, mary says we should lockdown - i dunno, sounds good to me, let's GOOOOOO!!!"?


- I think herd mentality sets in… local governments just follow whatever everyone else is doing…nobody wants to appear not to prioritize safety






or is it that you disagree with the risk/reward assessments that have been made?  perfectly understandable, but don't grandstand that no one is looking at the costs.

- I think the costs are minimized..i don’t hear a lot of talk about it… I think the politicians in many places largely just follow what the public health professionals say

Sorry about the formatting
« Last Edit: December 20, 2021, 09:30:43 pm by Starsky »

Starsky

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sweetcell

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3788 on: December 21, 2021, 12:02:34 am »
Ryan Struyk @ryanstruyk

Latest CDC data by vaccine status:

Unvaccinated: 451 cases per 100k
Vaccinated: 134 cases per 100k
Boosted: 48 cases per 100k

Unvaccinated: 6.1 deaths per 100k
Vaccinated: 0.5 deaths per 100k
Boosted: 0.1 deaths per 100k
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sweetcell

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3789 on: December 21, 2021, 12:10:12 am »
But Sweetcell sort of embodies the general mindset among liberals. Anyone that so much as lifts a peep against the prevailing orthodoxy on how society handles covid is mocked.

i understand why you feel that why.  i don't agree, i think you're wrong about your assessment of me, but i understand.


the flip side of this is that you embody the general mindset among those who put themselves ahead of collective concerns.  "i don't care if someone else's grandma dies, i want *my* kids back in school (so they are less of a burden)!  FREEDOMS!!!!"  i suspect you're about to tear into me about how that isn't the case, that isn't why you think what you think... to you i say: please see my first paragraph above.  we're both being reductionist.
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Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3790 on: December 21, 2021, 12:16:39 am »
Exactly odds of death for the vaccinated are Infinitesimally small and yet we are canceling everything as if we are in early 2020…. Well it’s not early 2020… we have vaccines, boosters…. Better medicines for serious cases


If people don’t want to get vaccinated the risk is on them… we don’t need to shut down and cancel our activities on their behalf…we don’t need to go into a recession because of them..

There are still issues that need to be addressed…what to do about kids too young to be vaccinated, what about nurses in hospitals overrun by unvaccinated sick people? And much more…



April 21 2020 US had reported about 27,000 new cases and 2700 deaths. There was no vaccine available to those 2700 people who died.

Today 143,000 new cases and 650 deaths overwhelmingly composed of people that chose to die by not getting vaccinated (I realize it’s a Monday…I realize we test more now)

But the  situation is so different we shouldn’t act as if we have to do the same things we did then
« Last Edit: December 21, 2021, 12:38:52 am by Starsky »

sweetcell

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3791 on: December 21, 2021, 12:48:23 am »
how many years do they need to stay home? Forever?

don't be a drama queen.  the last lockdown wasn't forever (and in this country, it wasn't even really a lockdown). 

-Drama Queen? I think it’s been a big deal.

your use of "forever" came across as over the top.  mandates and lockdowns have come and gone, depending on prevailing conditions.  nothing has been "forever" so far, so invoking that possibility is pure hyperbole.

Why couldn’t it last forever? If the virus is around forever and mutates who knows?

indeed, no one knows.  however, pathogens follow a pretty predictable arc: with time they become more widespread (more contagious), but less severe (fewer deaths).  makes sense: if a pathogen becomes more deadly, it will run out of people to infect and kill.  this is why some are saying that SARS-COV-2 will eventually become like the flu: endemic, unbeatable, and low impact (for the vaccinated).  trying to scare folks with statements to the effect that if we continue to follow the science we'll all have to spend the rest of our lives indoors is both wrong and dishonest.

I don’t want to say too much more personal cause some seem to derive joy from using things against one but there were other impacts
 
yeah, best to avoid personal details.  sad but true.

"what?  i have to take a BATH?!?  how long to do i have to stay in the tub, FOREVER?!?!?!111"

- seems immature on your part…this is what you mean about a debate?
- What is with the condescension man? Just make your points and spare me that

i was trying t illustrate how immature your hyperbolic argument sounded, but this is a valid criticism.  i could have said that otherwise.

- I didn’t mean my kids specifically fool
 
i'm sorry, what were you just saying a moment ago?

the failure to balance all the costs with the benefit… as if a case of covid for a fully vaccinated person who wears masks to school is automatic death…

no one is saying that (again, the hyperbole).  and, one's own death shouldn't be the only motivating force in society.
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Cock Van Der Palm

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3792 on: December 21, 2021, 09:02:22 am »
Been out of pocket a while. What I miss?  Everyone good and getting along?  Merry Christmas y'all!!

Starsky

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3793 on: December 21, 2021, 10:44:28 am »

Space Freely

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Re: COVID-19 2020
« Reply #3794 on: December 21, 2021, 09:02:37 pm »
Ryan Struyk @ryanstruyk

Latest CDC data by vaccine status:

Unvaccinated: 451 cases per 100k
Vaccinated: 134 cases per 100k
Boosted: 48 cases per 100k

Unvaccinated: 6.1 deaths per 100k
Vaccinated: 0.5 deaths per 100k
Boosted: 0.1 deaths per 100k

what time frame do thosr numbers cover?