World Cup Qualifying

[vansmack]

Hey Mank,
 
 3 out of 5 of my dream draw of England, Scotland, Wales, the Republic, and Northern Ireland.
 
 England should smoke their group and the Republic needs to overcome it's troubles with the Swiss to get through.
 
 GROUP ONE
 Czech Republic
 Netherlands
 Romania
 Finland
 FYR Macedonia
 Armenia
 Andorra
 
 GROUP TWO
 Turkey
 Denmark
 Greece
 Ukraine
 Georgia
 Albania
 Kazakhstan
 
 GROUP THREE
 Portugal
 Russia
 Slovakia
 Latvia
 Estonia
 Liechtenstein
 Luxembourg
 
 GROUP FOUR
 France
 REPUBLIC OF IRELAND
 Switzerland
 Israel
 Cyprus
 Faroe Islands
 
 GROUP FIVE
 Italy
 Slovenia
 SCOTLAND
 Norway
 Belarus
 Moldova
 
 GROUP SIX
 ENGLAND
 Poland
 Austria
 WALES
 NORTHERN IRELAND
 Azerbaijan
 
 GROUP SEVEN
 Spain
 Belgium
 Serbia & Montenegro
 Bosnia
 Lithuania
 San Marino
 
 GROUP EIGHT
 Sweden
 Croatia
 Bulgaria
 Iceland
 Hungary
 Malta

[mankie]

The England v Wales game should be a good one.
 
 I bet if the Republic hired Keano to be simply a bench/locker room motivator they'd be twice the team. They always have that "we'll do our best but don't expect to go far" attitude, which Keano would smack out of them....literally if he had to!  

I think this country will make the quarterfinals
 
   <img src="http://www.pinette.net/chris/flags/gay/gay-us-md.gif" alt=" - " />

[vansmack]

Originally posted by mankie:
  The England v Wales game should be a good one.
 
 I bet if the Republic hired Keano to be simply a bench/locker room motivator they'd be twice the team. They always have that "we'll do our best but don't expect to go far" attitude, which Keano would smack out of them....literally if he had to!    

I've stopped dwelling on the Irish squad "if only Keano..." idea.  They have the talent, but you're right, they don't have the heart as is apparent by their Euro 2004 performance losing out to the Swiss and Russia.  I've always hoped that the Duffer would slap them around a bit but apparently he's not a vocal leader and is really quiet off the pitch.  He just turns his motor on when he's on the pitch and that's not the leadership the squad needs.  Robbie Keane can only save this team so often.

[brennser]

They have the talent, but you're right, they don't have the heart as is apparent by their Euro 2004 performance losing out to the Swiss and Russia.  

I (politely of course) disagree vansmack.  I actually think the current Irish team is fairly bereft of talent, so when we lost someone of Keanes stature we became a quite ordinary team I think.
 
 Aside from Duff obviously, the other Keano, Stephen Carr and Shay Given I think all the other guys are fairly mediocre - looks at the squad for the swiss game....stockport, sunderland, west ham - thats just not going to cut it against he best in europe - I love mark kinsella and thought he did brilliantly at the world cup but he has no gas left in the tank.....mattie holland has been in a funk since 02 as well....david connolly is a headcase - we don't have a single midfielder who'd get into a top flight premiership team....reid and healy have prmise but they're just kids .....ian harte single handedly knocked us out of the world cup and is a crap defender to boot...I could go on and on......
 
 Goalkeepers: Shay Given (Newcastle United), Nick Colgan (Stockport), Joe Murphy (West Bromwich)
 
 Defenders: Gary Breen (Sunderland), Stephen Carr (Tottenham Hotspur), Gary Doherty (Tottenham Hotspur), Steve Finnan (Liverpool), Ian Harte (Leeds United), Andy O'Brien (Newcastle United), John O'Shea (Manchester United)
 
 Midfielders: Lee Carsley (Everton), Damien Duff (Chelsea), Colin Healy (Sunderland), Matt Holland (Charlton Athletic), Graham Kavanagh (Cardiff), Kevin Kilbane (Everton), Mark Kinsella (Aston Villa), Stephen McPhail (Nottingham Forest), Steven Reid (Blackburn Rovers)
 
 Strikers: David Connolly (West Ham), Robbie Keane (Tottenham Hotspur), Clinton Morrison (Birmingham City)

[ChampionshipVinyl]

Any love for Scotland against Italy out there?  Maybe they won't tank like they did against the Netherlands in Euro 2004 qualifying.

[ChampionshipVinyl]

'Course, the Dutch have to overcome the monkey of the Czech on their collective orange backs

[mankie]

I don't think smackie was saying Ireland is a sleeping Brazil...just that they have much more talent than the standard of play they are producing...a lot like England have been in recent years, but they are coming through now, thank God...I'm no expert on the Irish team, but think they just lack leadership on the field. After the Keane/McCarthy fiasco during the world cup I told my wife they were done once Keane was gone, because he's the leader they now lack....my wife is Irish and I'm English in case you were wondering what the hell my missus had to do with it!  
 
 From what I read Keane was kicked out because he got pissed off that the coaches weren't taking the competition seriously enough...no?

[mankie]

Originally posted by Baltimore:
  Any love for Scotland against Italy out there?  Maybe they won't tank like they did against the Netherlands in Euro 2004 qualifying.

I support four national teams.
 England
 Ireland
 Wales
 Whoever's playing Scotland

[vansmack]

Originally posted by brennser:
  I (politely of course) disagree vansmack.  I actually think the current Irish team is fairly bereft of talent, so when we lost someone of Keanes stature we became a quite ordinary team I think.

Footie chat on this board is always polite unless we're talking about Arsenal.  Or the French national team.  Or is there a difference?
 
 Anyhow, I agree that against the group A qualifiers (ENG, TUR, ITA, ESP, CZE, SWE, POR, FRA), they're not a good team.  But I think they were talented enough to get out of a qualifying group with Russia and Switzerland to make Euro 2004.  This team is underacheiving at the moment.  Other than Holland in group B, they're as good, if not better than Croatia, Belgium, Slovenia, Russia and Denmark.
 
 The current Irish squad, with as many players in the Premiership as they have, should finish second in a group with France, Switzerland, Israel, Cyprus and the Faroe Islands - even without Keano.
 
 They were talented and smart enough to have Spain frustrated and but for Ian Harte, would have had their best showing ever in the 2002 World Cup.  They were also the only team to score againsy Germany until Brazil ripped them apart in the finals.
 
 They're not part of Europe's elite, but they're good enough to make the world cup and should have made Euro 2004.

[vansmack]

Originally posted by mankie:
  I don't think smackie was saying Ireland is a sleeping Brazil...just that they have much more talent than the standard of play they are producing...

Word.
 
 

Originally posted by mankie:
 
 From what I read Keane was kicked out because he got pissed off that the coaches weren't taking the competition seriously enough...no?

He was upset at the entire approach the Irish FA takes to the game, from the coaches to the training grounds, to the attitude of the players to the amount of press vs. the practice.  And I'm not arguing whether he was right or worng because I think he was both.

[brennser]

lots to talk about here mankie - we're certainly no Brazil but I stand by my comment that apart from 4 what I would call 'world class' players we are just not a good team, a mix of the young, the mediocre and the washed up - england have always been a little different - they've always had tons of talent but couldn't put it all together
 
 you're right that they do a bit of leadership though
 
 as for the whole Keane thing its a long story going back years that ultimately boils down to general amateurishness on the part of the FAI...poor organization, shoddy treatment of players etc....BUT....there was long standing bad blood between Keane and McCarthy dating back to when McCarthy was captain and Keane a kid and that played a huge factor as well....AND....you could argue that preparations for the World Cup were actually the best that had ever been put in place for an Irish team.....the party line is that the week on that island was intended as a relaxation week with some light training to let players recover from the long season etc which was to be followed up with 2 weeks of more serious training and preparations on the mainland of Japan....its really very sad because without Keane I still firmly believe we could have gotten to the semis and with Keane, well who knows....all the stars were in alignment, Duff and Robbie Keane announcing their arrival on the world stage, Keane, Quinn (who terrified international defences for 15 years) and Staunton bidding farewell, and Holland, Breen and Kinsella playing well above their capabilities but it wasn't meant to be

[vansmack]

Originally posted by Baltimore:
  'Course, the Dutch have to overcome the monkey of the Czech on their collective orange backs

They might want to start with the racism on the team.  If they can get the white players and the Dutch-Africans on the same page, they're a scary team.

[mankie]

I think we are all agreeing on Keane issue,just in different ways...put yourself in Keano's shoes for a moment. He captains the biggest club in the world, one of the most successful clubs in the world, which is managed and organized in such a way...he then goes to represent his country,the biggest honor an athlete can have, that puts footie behind Gaelic football, Hurling and Rugby. It has to be difficult for him, with the passion for winning that he has. He's a hot-head no question, but don't punish someone for having the drive to win..when he called McCarthy a "fucking Brit", now that was funny.     I'm not saying he's 100% right because at the very least he should've unloaded on McCarthy behind closed doors.
 
 
 As for the Dutch...they also have a slight ego problem to deal with alongside any race concerns they may have. If they ever get their off-field issues solved they'll make Brazil look like Warminster Rovers. IMHO of course.

[brennser]

ego problem...oh yeah, you should have seen the stunned look on their faces when the final whistle blew after we beat the 1-0 at Lansdowne road - a mate of mine who's a big rugby fan was there and said it was the greatest atmosphere at any sporting event he's ever been to...