Author Topic: iphone  (Read 395844 times)

Herr Professor Doktor Doom

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Re: iphone
« Reply #705 on: April 21, 2011, 07:47:42 pm »
conspiracy theorists have put forth the idea that apple did this at the request of The Government.  personally, i think apple did this because they could. 

I'm not defending Apple at all, I think they suck.   I think my point is more along the lines of what you say above.   And I hadn't thought about the subpoena issue.     

I'm sure I'm offending a wide swath here, but in general I think you can't trust data geeks... whether it's Julian Assange, Steve Jobs or Sergeiy Brin, they think they are entitled to any information they come across.

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sweetcell

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Re: iphone
« Reply #706 on: April 21, 2011, 08:32:35 pm »
in general I think you can't trust data geeks... whether it's Julian Assange, Steve Jobs or Sergeiy Brin, they think they are entitled to any information they come across.

i think that's a very valid apprehension.  i have worked with the my firm's Data Forensics team, and i've been struck at the shockingly neutral & agnostic view they take of data: it's a stream of 1's and 0's that in the right hands can be turned into money.  data is neutral, and data wants to be free.  it's not people's lives, it doesn't have real-work repercussions (other than maybe financial).  quality of life?  sorry, can't be measured, and isn't implicitly captured in the data...
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Jaguar

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Re: iphone
« Reply #707 on: April 22, 2011, 01:28:46 am »
As Sweets said, the data itself is neutral. The real problem comes in with who has access to all that data and what they may decide to do with that data. While, yes, there is definitely a certain degree of a caveat emptor element to what the user throws out there, you can't just always blame the user for what can be done with all those details.

We too often have a real blind trust towards others who might have access to our data. In other cases, there's also a lot of data mining and snooping done that we know almost nothing about. Some less innocuous than others while some could be downright devastating in the wrong hands regardless of how innocent any given detail may be. It's really not that big of a deal if some company is only using very basic statistics about the demographics of the type of person who might buy their products. Using your personal information to sell to anyone who wants to buy your personal information for whatever they choose to do with that information is a whole other story. Would you like some Temporance nutcase knocking on your door like a Jehovah's Witness pusher just because you occasionally buy a bottle of wine at your local liquor store? Or maybe not get that coveted job interview because they choose to assume that you might just have a drinking problem regardless of what the truth might be? The potential is there to be totally exploited in any way another may choose from marketing to who gets what job or even used to gather information for some sort of character assassination. Just think for a moment about what the Nixon administration was up to regarding the Watergate break in. Oh, and don't forget the Stasi and how they collected all sorts of very detailed files on their citizens and for what purposes, all without the technology we have today.

It's very important to not always be so naive and trusting in the real world by thinking, 'well, if you aren't doing anything wrong, you shouldn't have anything to worry about'. Sure, we 'shouldn't' but the fact is, just like how numbers can be manipulated and distorted by any good publicity agent, lawyer, politician, sales person, etc., so can any given detail about your personal life by anyone who has an agenda that may not be in your best interest.

Seriously, in many cases, it's none of their damn business! Think about it for a moment; if you end up at a sobriety road stop, would you want Big Brother downloading every bit of data from your cell phone regardless of what they may or may not be doing with it? Today, it may be because you ran a stop sign (even though that is not sufficient cause to extract your data though we see it's been done in Michigan). Tomorrow it's anyone they randomly choose to walk up to on the street if we let them continue to tighten up on us like this. History has proven that this is how Totalitarian societies get, maintain and abuse control. Don't ever automatically assume that 'it can't happen here' because, yes, it can!

There's all sorts of other technologies they (be it corporate, government or otherwise) can use on us that hasn't even been hinted at here. Some have already been developed and are even in use while others are still in the R&D stages. Corporate spying is supposedly a big user of some of this stuff while 'the authorities' are another. Then you have the nosy and possibly even psychotic geek head who have their own purposes. So, yeah, caveat emptor but we too must be vigilant and not let so many others abuse the ability to grab our data just because they can. Of course, when it's brought to their attention they will always claim some high minded purpose like refining your personal browsing experiences to preventing terrorism but, the truth is, that's not always their true intentions. It is our jobs to be informed and take action to protect ourselves, be it regarding our personal use to actively getting involved with various privacy advocates who act to protect our rights. The choice is yours and should always be your choice, not that of anyone with the money and power to exploit for their own benefit however they see fit.
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Herr Professor Doktor Doom

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Re: iphone
« Reply #708 on: April 22, 2011, 11:58:14 am »
People have been saying a totalitarian society is near since the day this country was founded, and that notion seems more preposterous than ever.   If nothing else, it can be conclusively demonstrated that the "big brother" model of governance is bad for business, and what's good for business is what is setting the pace of our country's future.

the more likely scenario is companies and unethical individuals taking advantage of personal data in ways big and small, and in ways that haven't even been foreseen yet.   Software is getting so complex that companies like Apple can insert things like this tracking file that go for years without being detected, and they will continue to do so.   And even companies aren't monolithic, and don't have total control or knowledge of what their own divisions and individual employees choose to insert in software.   Who knows what else is out there.

So there's a lot to be concerned about ... but the Soviet style "big brother" scenario, though, is something that will stay in the 20th Century.   That's what the yahoos forming militias and filling their garages with ammo don't get.

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Jaguar

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Re: iphone
« Reply #709 on: April 22, 2011, 12:38:42 pm »
I'm sure that the people in Michigan would disagree.

Also, the majority of those across the planet who would disagree with you are not 'yahoos forming militias and filling their garages with ammo'. Most of them are just regular good and generally law abiding citizens who see what's going on around them and how its been changing over the years. Without naming any of them, I know of bands who don't like touring here because of how much of a police state we've turned into. One, in particular, refuse to come back because of that very reason regardless of the fact that they do have the fan base who would love for them to return. Another that I know of was totally freaked out a few years ago from what they witnessed and had to go through. Maybe your personal experiences have been easy on you but there are countless examples and practices that have gone through that demonstrates that we are slipping downwards. Yes, many have fought and will continue to fight for our rights with varying results. Thank God for those who know the difference between true freedom and are aware of how other factions continue to chip away at them; otherwise, we would be that much worse off. 

With all due respect, you would make a very easy frog to boil.
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godsshoeshine

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Re: iphone
« Reply #710 on: April 22, 2011, 12:48:39 pm »
by "here" do you mean dc or the united states?
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walkonby

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Re: iphone
« Reply #711 on: April 22, 2011, 01:21:31 pm »
i like the fact that in the terminator movies, skynet became self aware on april 19, 2011.  and mister cameron remarked that we have indeed been controlled by mindless robots due to these horrid addictions to iphones and blackberries and androids.  i mean come on . . . they're called androids.

Jaguar

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Re: iphone
« Reply #712 on: April 22, 2011, 01:22:13 pm »
by "here" do you mean dc or the united states?

You need to clarify yourself and tell us who you are asking.

If you are referring to this sentence of mine:

"Without naming any of them, I know of bands who don't like touring here because of how much of a police state we've turned into."

... 'here' means in the US, although the one band that I mentioned was particularly freaked out while in DC as opposed to any other location they played.
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godsshoeshine

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Re: iphone
« Reply #713 on: April 22, 2011, 01:27:27 pm »
sorry, that's what i was asking, yes

can i ask what country these bands are from? i'd assume the uk, but they have cctv on every street there
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Jaguar

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Re: iphone
« Reply #714 on: April 22, 2011, 01:32:23 pm »
can i ask what country these bands are from? i'd assume the uk, but they have cctv on every street there

One is from the UK and the other is from Ireland. Btw, it wasn't only the cameras that freaked out the one band. It was stuff much more aggressive and intrusive than that but I really don't feel comfortable blabbing too much else on their personal experiences.

Yes, I know those countries, among others, have their own squeezing fists to deal with but none of that justifies it going on anywhere else, especially within our own country. Thing is, it's really a global effort coordinated to control us all. All these fists work hand in hand and it's not always for the reasons they claim.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 01:35:57 pm by Jaguar »
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godsshoeshine

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Re: iphone
« Reply #715 on: April 22, 2011, 01:48:58 pm »
interesting

ireland i can totally see. they do what they want to do. place is crazier than i guessed. but in a good way
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Herr Professor Doktor Doom

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Re: iphone
« Reply #716 on: April 22, 2011, 07:07:06 pm »
I don't know about Ireland, but bands coming to the US from the UK and bitching that we're a police state is pretty rich, given that in the UK people can get thrown in jail for far less cause than here.    Maybe they got treated rudely at immigration, but the customs folks at Heathrow are no less ugly to people who aren't citizens.

Anyway, there are also a ton of working class people who've been successfully convinced that taxing the rich is bad for them... so Jaguar, with all respect, the opinions of a bunch of people and bands offer no reflection on what's real or not.



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vansmack

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Re: iphone
« Reply #717 on: April 22, 2011, 07:26:45 pm »
Back to the topic of note....

Gizmodo has done a decent job of explaining the difference between iOS/Android/WP7 with a chart:

Linky....
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Jaguar

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Re: iphone
« Reply #718 on: April 22, 2011, 07:45:29 pm »
Doom, history proves otherwise, especially since the Patriot Act.

Anyway, to lighten up the mood with a piece somewhat related in this article, I found a comment that cracked me up. It's about a site called Foursquare that is a location-sharing social network.

"Because Foursquare was down, millions had no clue where they were."
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Herr Professor Doktor Doom

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Re: iphone
« Reply #719 on: April 23, 2011, 04:13:49 pm »
Back to the topic of note....

Gizmodo has done a decent job of explaining the difference between iOS/Android/WP7 with a chart:

Linky....

that's great... and as an added bonus takes us back from "vast global conspiracy" to "panic, but just a tiny bit."
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