TBD

[chaz]

However, I would welcome some sort of required parenting classes, as would happily sigh up as soon as they are available.

Don't wish for that.  These sorts of things are aimed at the lowest common denominator. 

When my first wife and I got divorced we had to take a co-parenting class, as ordered by the judge.  Not sure if this was by law or what, but we had to take it.  It was the stupidest waste of time.  Pretty much an entire weekend totally wasted.  A transmission of completely obvious information.

Not to mention, it did nothing to improve the ex's co-parenting skills, or parenting skills for that matter.  She is dead now, so no longer have to deal with that challenge.

Happily, my picker has since gone in for extensive service and is now a finely tuned high performance machine.

[James Ford]

Yes, very good points.

Perhaps I should have phrased it as "required classes that people would have the ability to test out of".

Of course even with classes you would have people performing poorly as parents. Even people with common sense and/or proper training still make dumb mistakes. Myself included.

However, I would welcome some sort of required parenting classes, as would happily sigh up as soon as they are available.

Don't wish for that.  These sorts of things are aimed at the lowest common denominator. 

When my first wife and I got divorced we had to take a co-parenting class, as ordered by the judge.  Not sure if this was by law or what, but we had to take it.  It was the stupidest waste of time.  Pretty much an entire weekend totally wasted.  A transmission of completely obvious information.

Not to mention, it did nothing to improve the ex's co-parenting skills, or parenting skills for that matter.  She is dead now, so no longer have to deal with that challenge.

Happily, my picker has since gone in for extensive service and is now a finely tuned high performance machine.

[hutch]

Lets get real here... we are not going to get 3 years of paid leave..it just isn't going to happen...we barely get two weeks vacation!


within what is possible the best hope for the most children is increased flexibility in where people can send their kids....

i mean everyone should have a right to a similar basic public education....but a supreme court decision in the 70s ruled that different districts can spend completely different amounts on their kids...so forget about that but if ever there was something that should be changed its this.. ain't gonna happen...the land of unequal opportunity.


because of the court rulling many kids will get screwed so i'm all for vouchers, charter schools, flexibility in where people can send children, home schooling, you name it.... this idea that parents need to send their kids to craptastic schools because they are in their neighborhood is ridiculous...

what people never realize as they pat themselves on the back about their fantastic parenting is that how well kids do is largely predetermined by their genes and their environment (yes, their parents money)...

i was part of a tutor mentor program in DC for a few years.... the kids don't stand a chance... when the kid lost his text book what do you think the parent said? I'm not paying for a textbook. what do you think the teacher did? nothing...six weeks went by.. is it any wonder the kid didn't give a shit about school? i wonder what lamar brennan is up to now.

[RatBastard]

No I meant raising minimum wage ...lowering day care costs, lowering health care costs, making college free for everyone that scores above a certain level on standardized tests.  You still have to work. 

So in other words you want to get paid more for flipping burgers at McDonalds, but people who have actually worked to earn an education and better themselves need to get paid less for providing much more valuable services and they pay more taxes so you can get more 'free shit'!  Wow where do I sign up to sit on my ass, take no personal responsibility to better myself, and make everyone else in society pay my way?  The only thing wrong with your plan is that it does not include a free two week all expenses paid vacation to the destination of my choice each year so I can deal with the stress of watching those burgers fry all day!

(In case no one has clued you in yet there is no such thing as free.)

[James Ford]

So if flipping burgers and working a white dollar desk job paid the same, you'd choose to flip burgers?

No I meant raising minimum wage ...lowering day care costs, lowering health care costs, making college free for everyone that scores above a certain level on standardized tests.  You still have to work. 

So in other words you want to get paid more for flipping burgers at McDonalds, but people who have actually worked to earn an education and better themselves need to get paid less for providing much more valuable services and they pay more taxes so you can get more 'free shit'!  Wow where do I sign up to sit on my ass, take no personal responsibility to better myself, and make everyone else in society pay my way?  The only thing wrong with your plan is that it does not include a free two week all expenses paid vacation to the destination of my choice each year so I can deal with the stress of watching those burgers fry all day!

(In case no one has clued you in yet there is no such thing as free.)

[James Ford]

But there are plenty of people who could choose to stay home with their children for three years with proper financial planning, and sacrificing some of life's luxuries for awhile. But they don't.

Lets get real here... we are not going to get 3 years of paid leave..it just isn't going to happen...we barely get two weeks vacation!


within what is possible the best hope for the most children is increased flexibility in where people can send their kids....

i mean everyone should have a right to a similar basic public education....but a supreme court decision in the 70s ruled that different districts can spend completely different amounts on their kids...so forget about that but if ever there was something that should be changed its this.. ain't gonna happen...the land of unequal opportunity.


because of the court rulling many kids will get screwed so i'm all for vouchers, charter schools, flexibility in where people can send children, home schooling, you name it.... this idea that parents need to send their kids to craptastic schools because they are in their neighborhood is ridiculous...

what people never realize as they pat themselves on the back about their fantastic parenting is that how well kids do is largely predetermined by their genes and their environment (yes, their parents money)...

i was part of a tutor mentor program in DC for a few years.... the kids don't stand a chance... when the kid lost his text book what do you think the parent said? I'm not paying for a textbook. what do you think the teacher did? nothing...six weeks went by.. is it any wonder the kid didn't give a shit about school? i wonder what lamar brennan is up to now.

[RatBastard]

I also think allowing to get tax credits or even tax credits for paying for private education would help.  And letting people put their kids into any public school in the state.  Why should kids be forced to go to an awful school just because their parents aren't living in a rich neighborhood.

This is an absolutely absurd idea.  No one FORCES anyone to send their child to public school.  You have the option to use the schools that the state provides at no direct cost to you OR you can foot the bill to go elsewhere.  By your moronic logic all of the following should be enacted...


1) If I do not have children I should get a cash refund of all taxes paid to fund education since I am not using that service.

2) if I have a fire alarm system in my house I should get a voucher for the part of my taxes that go to pay for a fire department.  I should not be forced to use the state provided fire department.

3) If I have guns in my house and use them to defend myself I should get a voucher for the part of my taxes that go to pay for the police.  I should not be forced to use the protection that the state provides.

4) If I do not own a motor vehicle I should get a voucher for all taxes paid to fund the DMV.  I do not use their services therefore I should not have to pay.

5) If I do not drive I should get a voucher for all taxes paid to build and maintain roadways.  I should not have to pay for something I do not use.

6) If I am gainfully employed I should get a voucher for all taxes paid to fund food stamps, welfare, or any other free shot for lazy people.  Since I am being a responsible productive member of society and I do not use these services I should get a voucher for them.

It is all the same thing.  No difference what-so-ever.  What you (and many people who want free shit) forget is that there is no such thing as free and further what taxes we do pay are not intended to result in a one for one benefit for any given member of society.  Just because you CHOOSE not to use a specific benefit that taxes fund does not mean that you get your money back.

[hutch]

But there are plenty of people who could choose to stay home with their children for three years with proper financial planning, and sacrificing some of life's luxuries for awhile. But they don't.

well not everyone is as smart/good a person as you james ford

you're just talking out of your ass really dude... you don't know what people on this board do...for all you know somebody is a stay at home dad or someone works and their wife takes care of the kids at home...

anyways, i love you but you're boring me.

[James Ford]

Never said that wasn't the case. There are plenty of people who do make good decisions, and plenty more for whom it's just not a possibility.

Still, I think one or even two years of paid parental leave is certainly within reason. Maybe not at 100% of the salary...but the US could do much better in this area.

But there are plenty of people who could choose to stay home with their children for three years with proper financial planning, and sacrificing some of life's luxuries for awhile. But they don't.

well not everyone is as smart/good a person as you james ford

you're just talking out of your ass really dude... you don't know what people on this board do...for all you know somebody is a stay at home dad or someone works and their wife takes care of the kids at home...

anyways, i love you but you're boring me.

[atomic]

I also think allowing to get tax credits or even tax credits for paying for private education would help.  And letting people put their kids into any public school in the state.  Why should kids be forced to go to an awful school just because their parents aren't living in a rich neighborhood.

I am insane and I am spouting off nonsense.  No need to read it.

This is how I read what you posted.

[atomic]

No I meant raising minimum wage ...lowering day care costs, lowering health care costs, making college free for everyone that scores above a certain level on standardized tests.  You still have to work. 

So in other words you want to get paid more for flipping burgers at McDonalds, but people who have actually worked to earn an education and better themselves need to get paid less for providing much more valuable services and they pay more taxes so you can get more 'free shit'!  Wow where do I sign up to sit on my ass, take no personal responsibility to better myself, and make everyone else in society pay my way?  The only thing wrong with your plan is that it does not include a free two week all expenses paid vacation to the destination of my choice each year so I can deal with the stress of watching those burgers fry all day!

(In case no one has clued you in yet there is no such thing as free.)

If someone gets paid 15 dollars an hour to work at McDonalds that doesn't come close to the amount of money I earn and if it leads to less crime then I benefit from it.  Also they will need less government support as they are getting higher wages.  I never eat at McDonalds so I get no benefit from them paying their employees so low that they qualify for welfare, food stamps, and medicaid.  I also don't shop at Walmart, eat at Burger King or frequent establishments that pay their workers minimum wage. 

[hutch]

Never said that wasn't the case. There are plenty of people who do make good decisions, and plenty more for whom it's just not a possibility.

Still, I think one or even two years of paid parental leave is certainly within reason. Maybe not at 100% of the salary...but the US could do much better in this area.

no doubt... but there is no interest.. the interest lies in having people work Thanksgiving now..or haven't you heard? I see it as a non-starter...

[atomic]

Never said that wasn't the case. There are plenty of people who do make good decisions, and plenty more for whom it's just not a possibility.

Still, I think one or even two years of paid parental leave is certainly within reason. Maybe not at 100% of the salary...but the US could do much better in this area.

no doubt... but there is no interest.. the interest lies in having people work Thanksgiving now..or haven't you heard? I see it as a non-starter...

People in this country have been brainwashed pretty well.  I always think you can learn from others.  And there are other countries who's system works better than ours but it won't ever change here as people have been convinced that it is best the way it is. 

I would  never shop on Thanksgiving.

[James Ford]

You definitely talk some good sense when you're not deliberately trolling.
 

Never said that wasn't the case. There are plenty of people who do make good decisions, and plenty more for whom it's just not a possibility.

Still, I think one or even two years of paid parental leave is certainly within reason. Maybe not at 100% of the salary...but the US could do much better in this area.

no doubt... but there is no interest.. the interest lies in having people work Thanksgiving now..or haven't you heard? I see it as a non-starter...

People in this country have been brainwashed pretty well.  I always think you can learn from others.  And there are other countries who's system works better than ours but it won't ever change here as people have been convinced that it is best the way it is. 

I would  never shop on Thanksgiving.

[atomic]

Christine McVie has re-joined Fleetwood Mac.