Schedule for Operation Cease Fire?

[Julian, Alleged Computer F**kface]

Originally posted by callat703:
  (sitting in a jail cell isn't a viable choice for most people),

Oh really? Given the choice between me shooting you in the head or sitting in jail for five years, which would you choose? It's a viable choice then. But given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head or sitting in jail for five years, then it's not? Intriguing.
 
 I think that says more about how much we value other people's lives then anything else.

[Sage 703]

That's blatantly untrue. You act like the second they joined the military, they became a robot, devoid of thought and reason. Any US soldier over there can CHOOSE at any time to be shipped back here and sit in Fort Levenworth for a few. They choose not to, for one of various reasons, which I've highlighted already.
 
 Certainly, that wouldn't stop THE WAR as a whole, but it'd stop THEIR PERSONAL INVOLVEMENT in it, which is what I applaud or boo people on.  

Yes, but like I keep saying, this isn't a viable option for most people.  And it isn't just because they're a "robot."  These men and women have loyalties to each other as well - for those that can afford to stand on principle and oppose the war, there are countless others of their fellow soldiers who cannot - and standing on principle would force you to abandon those loyalties.
 
 The military is a fraternity that we can't possibly begin to understand or appreciate if we're not involved in it - the relationships and loyalties developed there are probably more intense than any we'll ever have.
 
   

But given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head or sitting in jail for five years, then it's not? Intriguing.
 
 I think that says more about how much we value other people's lives then anything else.  

The choice isn't this simplistic; you've reduced it too far.  The choice is based on far more things than just this - lets expand on it.
 
 "Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have them shoot you in the head?  Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have your family go without food and housing?  Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have your best friend shot in the head?  Given the choice to between having to shoot someone else in the head, or abandon everything else in your future that you've worked for (see above mention of dishonorable discharge)?"
 
 I could go on, but shouldn't have to.

[Julian, Alleged Computer F**kface]

Originally posted by callat703:
  "Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have them shoot you in the head?  

I think we can all agree that would be justified.
 
 

Originally posted by callat703:
 Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have your family go without food and housing?

Irrelative because it's entirely unrealistic. It's not a logical reasonable conclusion that your family will starve and be evicted if you go to jail. As loathe as we might find hyper-liberals, the second someone did what I was suggesting if it turned out like you're saying, contribution funds and the like would come up from the Michael Moore's of the world.
 
 The more authentic question is "given the choice between shooting someone in the head or endure financial hardship temporarily and diminished future earnings". Um, yeah...
 
 

Originally posted by callat703:
  Given the choice between having to shoot someone else in the head, or have your best friend shot in the head?

Defense of others. Again, though, has zero to do with this situation.
 
 

Originally posted by callat703:
  Given the choice to between having to shoot someone else in the head, or abandon everything else in your future that you've worked for (see above mention of dishonorable discharge)?"

See my above. Some people are poor and live on the streets - should they be able to kill people to take their wallet?

[Guiny]

Originally posted by [username edited by p.c. moderator]:
 Some people are poor and live on the streets - should they be able to kill people to take their wallet? [/QB]

No, they just blame Bush for being poor.

[Sage 703]

My point was not to give specific rationale for killing somebody; the point was to show that you're reducing your argument too far.  It isn't accurate to simply define the choice as "this or this."  There are far too many other considerations at play here - you can't throw out the other factors.  I'm not saying that its a direct choice between one or the other - I'm saying there is a sum of factors that play into your choice to sit in jail on principle, all of which I isolated for sake of argument and diction.

[Julian, Alleged Computer F**kface]

Originally posted by callat703:
  My point was not to give specific rationale for killing somebody; the point was to show that you're reducing your argument too far.  It isn't accurate to simply define the choice as "this or this."  There are far too many other considerations at play here - you can't throw out the other factors.  I'm not saying that its a direct choice between one or the other - I'm saying there is a sum of factors that play into your choice to sit in jail on principle, all of which I isolated for sake of argument and diction.

I understand there's a sum of factors that need considered, but it's my assertation that no collection of financial/job concerns qualify as reason enough to kill someone.

[Sage 703]

But I'm saying that it isn't purely financial - its also related to personal relationships, ties, loyalties, and self-preservation; plus, we haven't even touched on grander principles of honor and integrity.

[Julian, Alleged Computer F**kface]

Originally posted by callat703:
  But I'm saying that it isn't purely financial - its also related to personal relationships, ties, loyalties, and self-preservation; plus, we haven't even touched on grander principles of honor and integrity.

LOL. This is pointless. The mere fact you think honor, loyalty, or integrity don't lie entirely on the side of the "not killing people" side of the fence renders this whole thing prosaic.

People join the military for adventure.

[markie]

Is that why the  dolphins joined?

[Guiny]

The Army does more by 9 a.m. then most of us do all week.

Originally posted by MTB-Markie:
  Is that why the  dolphins joined?

They were drafted.

[markie]

Originally posted by Rob_Gee:
  The Army does more dolphins by 9 a.m. then most of us do all week.

<img src="http://centurionweb.co.za/fun/products/dolphin-camera.jpg" alt=" - " />

[walkonby]

i know this is way off the subject and all, but how was operation cease fire?  did anything change in our country because of it?  did jello realize that freedom of expression isn't free.  how much was bottled water? or the egg rolls, pizza, and big pretzels by street side vendors who sell american pride shirts, but they don't speak american beyond "two for twenty-five."  were the slaves there for the message, or for the le tigre show.  god, i love them girls.  i want to be their mojo jojo!

[HoyaSaxa03]

Originally posted by Rob_Gee:
  Polls aren't always accurate due to the fact that alot of people don't waste their time with them. Did they poll every single person in the U.S.? I don't remember getting that call.

ummm ... you're stupid. really stupid.
 
 i have a couple of books on survey methodology if you want to borrow them, they're really enlightening.